Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

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Sue Sue Applegate
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Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Sue Sue Applegate »

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Our Guest for March 22-24, 2013, is the author of the new biography,
Lee Marvin, Point Blank: Dwayne Epstein

Dwayne Epstein is the author of a number of young adult biographies,
covering such celebrity personalities as Adam Sandler, Will Ferrell, Hilary Swank,
Nancy Pelosi, Hillary Clinton and Denzel Washington for Lucent Books’ “People in
the News” series. Epstein also contributed to Bill Krohn’s bestselling books “Hitchcock
at Work” and “Joe Dante and the Gremlins of Hollywood.”Prior to writing biographies,
Epstein contributed to film chronicles on a regular basis. He wrote for Filmfax Magazine
on subjects such as Bobby Darin, the Rat Pack, television pioneer Steve Allen, film
director Sam Fuller, comic book artist Neal Adams, “Invasion of the Body Snatcher’s”
Kevin McCarthy, John Belushi and comedy legend Sid Caesar.
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Epstein later contributed to Cahiers Du Cinema’s “Serious Pleasures” which had a high
profile in Europe. He wrote on American films chosen for rediscovery by directors Oliver
Stone, Francis Ford Coppola, Woody Allen and Clint Eastwood. Early in his career, Epstein
earned his first professional writing credit reviewing films for Hearst Community
Newspapers. Epstein was born in New York’s Coney Island in 1960, and moved West with
his family at age 8, spending the rest of his childhood in Cerritos, Calif. He moved back
east, attended Mercer Community College in New Jersey, and also served as an assistant
editor for the five area newspapers of Cranbury Publications. Epstein made one more
cross-country move and currently resides in Long Beach, Calif. When he is not writing,
he enjoys watching and reading about movies and collecting soundtracks.
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Dwayne Epstein has just finished his national book tour visiting Savannah, Atlanta, Miami,
Tampa, Santa Monica, Palm Springs, and Huntington Beach, and has had several radio
interviews concerning his latest book: Lee Marvin, Point Blank.
Image

Mr. Epstein has interviewed celebrities Woody Strode, Jack Palance, Sam Fuller, John
Frankenheimer, Richard Fleischer, Steve Allen, Eddie Albert, Edward Dymtryk, Angie
Dickinson, Rod Taylor, Clint Walker, and many others. He has also interviewed Betty
and Christopher Marvin in preparation for his newest book.

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The SSO is proud to welcome Mr. Dwayne Epstein!
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by JackFavell »

Welcome, Mr. Epstein! It's wonderful to have you here at the SSO! I'm very glad that you chose Lee Marvin as you subject.

I think Lee Marvin may have the biggest following here at the SSO of any actor. I have quite a few questions, because he's a great favorite. Sorry to give you such a workout right off the bat!

Why did you choose Marvin as a subject? I think it says something about you as a person that you chose to write about him.

I'd really love to know about Marvin's war experiences and how they molded and shaped his acting. Did it influence the roles he took on? Was it why he became an actor?

What was his acting technique like? He seems absolutely unlike anyone else - you can't compare him to Brando, though I think he has as much power, if not more. He seems a bit old school to me, very much like a Gabin or a Spencer Tracy, but then there's something modern about him too. How did he prepare for a role, was he a proponent of the method, or was he one to come in and just say the words and not bump into the furniture, as Tracy once said?

Can you tell me a little about his work on The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance?

He has a depth and almost frightening focus that I think suggests violence, and yet when you see interviews with him, he's so erudite. What was the real Marvin like? I see a lot of introspection, masked by an outward bravado.
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by ChiO »

Welcome to SSO, Mr. Epstein.

To listen to John Boorman, it seems that Lee Marvin not only made superb individual decisions for his performance in POINT BLANK, he helped shape the film. Did Marvin have an unfulfilled dream of directing?

In an extended interview late in his life, Marvin speaks so fondly of several directors. Did he generally have good relationships with his directors, or was he reflecting nostalgically (or were the negative comments deleted)? I would be especially interested in his views of Don Siegel, Robert Aldrich and Samuel Fuller. Thinking of Fuller and Marvin together on THE BIG RED ONE, given their war experiences and tough guy images, is particularly intriguing.

Did Marvin consider any of his movies a turning point in his career? I think of THE BIG HEAT as a break-out performance, but what was his view?

Are there any anecdotes relating to his on- and off-screen relationships with Neville Brand (speaking of Tough Guy ex-military) and Timothy Carey?

Thank you for your time.
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Rita Hayworth »

Several questions in mind ...

1) How he managed to land the role of Orville "Flash" Perkins in Raintree County. I saw this movie several times in my life and its one of my favorite Elisabeth Taylor's movies and he was actually good in this movie. But, I felt that this movie wasn't his cup of tea ... and on the first time I saw this movie I was surprised to see his name in the opening credits portion of this movie.

2) Did he enjoyed doing "Donovan Reef" back in 1963?

3) I was surprised to see him doing the Dirty Dozen ... Made for TV Movie back in 1985. Why he did this?
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by movieman1957 »

Marvin was one of the most gifted "bad guys" on the big screen. I often marvel at how down right mean he could be. I'm not too familiar with much of his TV work, being large enough early on, (I have seen the first season of "M Squad") how would you say his film persona and his TV persona were, if at all, different?

Also with John Ford choosing him for "Valance" and "Donovan's Reef" so close together is there anything significant behind his selection for those films or did they just have a fine time and carry it on?
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Lzcutter »

Mr. Epstein,

Thank you so much for spending the weekend with us! I've been a major Lee fan for more years than I can count. My parents took me to see Cat Ballou and I went to see Paint Your Wagon a few years later. (I even owned the soundtrack album).

I know that Lee was slated to star in Sam Peckinpah's The Wild Bunch but opted instead to make Wagon. Did he have any regrets at not playing Pike Bishop in the Bunch?
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

Hellos to all and thanks for inviting me to your wonderful site. Please forgive me in advance for any typos or technical glitches I am bound to incur as I'm not very proficient in this sort of thing.
Okay, disclaimer stated, allow me to forge ahead with your queries & comments as best as I can:
JackFavell wrote:Welcome, Mr. Epstein! It's wonderful to have you here at the SSO! I'm very glad that you chose Lee Marvin as you subject.

I think Lee Marvin may have the biggest following here at the SSO of any actor. I have quite a few questions, because he's a great favorite. Sorry to give you such a workout right off the bat!

Why did you choose Marvin as a subject? I think it says something about you as a person that you chose to write about him.

I'd really love to know about Marvin's war experiences and how they molded and shaped his acting. Did it influence the roles he took on? Was it why he became an actor?

What was his acting technique like? He seems absolutely unlike anyone else - you can't compare him to Brando, though I think he has as much power, if not more. He seems a bit old school to me, very much like a Gabin or a Spencer Tracy, but then there's something modern about him too. How did he prepare for a role, was he a proponent of the method, or was he one to come in and just say the words and not bump into the furniture, as Tracy once said?

Can you tell me a little about his work on The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance?

He has a depth and almost frightening focus that I think suggests violence, and yet when you see interviews with him, he's so erudite. What was the real Marvin like? I see a lot of introspection, masked by an outward bravado.
Wow Jack, you are a Lee Marvin fan, aren't you? I'll tackle each of your questions individually but doing so in detail would give me writer's cramp. Suffice to say, a good many of your questions are answered specifically in the book for whom you seem to be the perfect candidate for! If you like, here's the Amazon link:
The short answer to your question why I wrote about Lee Marvin is that quite simply I'm fan and have been for most of my life. As a movie fan he's always intrigued me and the more research I did the more intrigued I became.

Marvin's experience in the war VERY much influenced his acting career. That posed a special problem for me as a writer since I did not want to write anything that might seem phony, having never experienced combat myself. I did get EXTREMELY lucky in finding all of his letters home during the war which had NEVER seen the light of the day. It was hard work transcribing them but the result allowed Marvin to basically write that chapter himself. It's almost entirely all in his own words.

As to Marvin and 'the method,' I discovered a story about that which I used in the introduction to make the point how Lee Marvin was different than any other actor of his generation. He did not care for such actors and yet found both Brando and Clift two of the best actors he ever worked with. Just one of the many paradoxes that is Lee Marvin.

For Liberty Valance, I interviewed his co-star Woody Strode who was very close to Marvin and even closer to John Ford. Strode could not have been nicer to me even though he was dying of pancreatic cancer at the time. It was one of, if not THE last interview he ever gave and he did for his love of both men. The stories he told me MUST be read to be truly appreciated.

As to what the real Lee Marvin was like, I'm afraid I dont know as I never met the man. He passed in '87 and began the project in '94. I get the feeling he mellowed a lot with age but there was a lot of violence in the man's life in spite of his gentleman demeanor. it's interesting that you picked up on that as it's a major theme in my book which I think you'll enjoy. Thanks for your questions, Jack!
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

ChiO wrote:Welcome to SSO, Mr. Epstein.

To listen to John Boorman, it seems that Lee Marvin not only made superb individual decisions for his performance in POINT BLANK, he helped shape the film. Did Marvin have an unfulfilled dream of directing?

In an extended interview late in his life, Marvin speaks so fondly of several directors. Did he generally have good relationships with his directors, or was he reflecting nostalgically (or were the negative comments deleted)? I would be especially interested in his views of Don Siegel, Robert Aldrich and Samuel Fuller. Thinking of Fuller and Marvin together on THE BIG RED ONE, given their war experiences and tough guy images, is particularly intriguing.

Did Marvin consider any of his movies a turning point in his career? I think of THE BIG HEAT as a break-out performance, but what was his view?

Are there any anecdotes relating to his on- and off-screen relationships with Neville Brand (speaking of Tough Guy ex-military) and Timothy Carey?

Thank you for your time.
Hmm, interesting questions. I have read in interviews that whenever he was asked about such things, he always made a joke and said he'd never direct, write, produce, etc. According to his first wife, Betty, whom I interviewed at length,Lee was a frustrated writer and they concocted several screenplays together. He helped with the original script for The WIld Bunch and had several properties he wanted to make into film but never wanted to put his own money into a production. As to directing, I never heard or read anything to that effect but it would not surprise me. He was a very versatile man and probably could have done it.
As to other directors, he got along with almost all of his directors and had said as much throughout his life. Aldrich was a particular favorite of his obviously since they worked together a lot, mainly because of the subject matter of the films, the cast Aldrich assembled and his no-nonsense style of directing. Marvin hated pretentious directors. Sam Fuller was also a favorite of his and the two men were very good friends who wanted to work together more often! Marvin's feelings for directors was such that sometimes a good director was able to talk Marvin into a role he otherwise would have turned down, such as Stanley Kramer talking him into Ship of Fools. I was lucky enough to interview both Kramer and Fuller for my book. The only director he was on record as ever having really not liked was Prime Cut's director, Michael Ritchie. In spite of Marvin's well known wild behavior, he actually had a pretty moral streak and despised what Ritchie wanted him to do in the film in relation to Sissy Spacek's character. He was very vocal and very public of his disadain for Ritchie.
The Big Heat was indeed a landmark for Marvin, without question. Unfortunately, it also lead to many more bad guy roles. He had many landmarks in his career as you probably know and it's amazing watching his star rise over time, especially since with his looks, he seemed the least likely candidate for stardom. Thank goodness the 60s changed all that!
As to for other tough guys, he was actually pretty good friends with some of them since they worked together a lot in the early days. I don't know about the wonderfully eccentric Tim Carey but men like L.Q. Jones, Neville Brand, Strother Martin, Jack Palance were poker buddies of Marvin's. I interviewed the underrated Leo Gordon who told me how Marvin and Brand "Put a few holes in the wall' (his words, not mine) in the hotel they stayed at during the filming of Gun Fury. I think he meant that metaphorically, but who knows?
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Sue Sue Applegate »

Dwayne, thank you for your lovely responses.

One of my favorite sections of your book describes how Woody Strode met Lee Marvin for the first time. And Lee was definitely upset about something. Can you clarify more specificallly what actually initiated the chain of events?

And personally, why do you think Ford was so impressed with Lee Marvin? Was it his initial Wayne film, The Comancheros?

We all appreciate your willingness to respond to our member's questions. Thanks, again!
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

kingme wrote:Several questions in mind ...

1) How he managed to land the role of Orville "Flash" Perkins in Raintree County. I saw this movie several times in my life and its one of my favorite Elisabeth Taylor's movies and he was actually good in this movie. But, I felt that this movie wasn't his cup of tea ... and on the first time I saw this movie I was surprised to see his name in the opening credits portion of this movie.

2) Did he enjoyed doing "Donovan Reef" back in 1963?

3) I was surprised to see him doing the Dirty Dozen ... Made for TV Movie back in 1985. Why he did this?
1) Like several films in Marvin's career I think Raintree County is a noble attempt in which parts of it are better than the whole.He did the film on the advice of his career-long agent Meyer Mishkin who had a long-term plan for his client's ultimate success. MGM on the other hand, was clearly trying to recapture the magic of Gone with The Wind with Raintree and didn't succeed. It certainly didn't help the troubled production that Clift suffered his near-fatal car accident during the film's production but bravely finished in spite of his pain. I always felt the best of the film's mammoth production include Marvin's performance (as well as supporting players Agnes Moorehead, Walter Abel, Nigel Patrick and Rod Taylor). Marvin's beleviable transformation from small town braggart to hardened war veteran is both believable and poignant. I was fortunate to interview screenwriter Millard Kaufman and co-star Rod Taylor and they were both VERY impressed with Marvin as an actor and as a man. Kaufman told me that after shooting Marvin's final scene, the crew broke out in applause which Kaufman had only seen once before from a film crew.
2) Donovan's Reef was a film Marvin was talked into doing by John Ford and at first the actor had a wonderful time with his family getting "brown as berries" as Ford promised him. All concerned had a wonderful time in the Island paradise but as filming progressed, Marvin's PTSD resulted in some odd and dark behavior that I learned about from his wife Betty and neighbors of the actor who experienced Marvin's erratic behavior. It certainly doesn't show in the film as he and John Wayne had great chemistry together. As to what Marvin did during the filming:
3) Yeah, The Dirty Dozen sequel was pretty sad to see, wasn't it? Why did he do it? His son Christopher explained it to me when he visited his father at the time. As his agent Meyer Mishkin told me about such work and his last film, the live-action cartoon Delta Force, Lee was a Marine, and it was as if he was daring the powers that be to kill him. Had he lived beyond such drivel, director Jim Jarmusch had written a King Lear-like film specifically for Marvin as Jarmusch was a lifelong fan. Marvin's passing before making the film began the now mysterious Sons of Lee Marvin...
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

Sue Sue Applegate wrote:Dwayne, thank you for your lovely responses.

One of my favorite sections of your book describes how Woody Strode met Lee Marvin for the first time. And Lee was definitely upset about something. Can you clarify more specificallly what actually initiated the chain of events?

And personally, why do you think Ford was so impressed with Lee Marvin? Was it his initial Ford film, The Comancheros?

We all appreciate your willingness to respond to our member's questions. Thanks, again!
There are some other questions to get to and I will in a little while but you raise some interesting points I'd like to respond to first. Woody Strode's story is a great one with a much more serious undercurrent to it than I realized at the time. I'm not an expert at all on the subject but based on basic symptoms, I discovered that Lee suffered from Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD). One such symptom is a rising sense of anxiety in certain situations which often results in drinking binges. Marvin's anxiety on Valance was the result of slow shooting schedule that was taking place. To him, it was taking everybody way too long to get things right and he began drinking. The dark cloud began forming and Ford asked Strode to kick Marvin off the set. This was a pattern of behavior others I interviewed pointed out as well that Marvin exhibited on The Killers, Cat Ballou, Point Blank, and other projects. Some called them anxiety attacks. With hindsight I think it's pretty clear that it was his undiagnosed PTSD.
Why do I think Ford was impressed with Marvin? Well, Marvin was Ford's kind of actor. The Comancheros was directed by Michael Curtiz, by the way (his last film) but Marvin's cameo performance so impressed co-star John Wayne, that he reccomend him to Ford for Liberty Valance. Marvin always said he learned how to act in the Marines and as flippant as that sounds, there is actually some truth to that. In the Marines he learned how to tell commanding officers what they wanted to hear to keep from getting in trouble and then do what he wanted or needed to do in order to get the job done. That is exactly what he did with directors and Ford was no exception. Ford was a classic manipulator of people and he met his match in Marvin. The two men admired each other's talent before they even met, and once they did, they proceeded to impress each other with what they did on the set. Woody Strode told me that most people were automatically intimated by Ford before they even met him, including John Wayne. Marvin had done his homework and apparently knew this going in, hence his behavior in Ford's presence who was enjoying everything Marvin. It's interesting also since Marvin thought he was going to be fired from the film (as stated in the book) before he even started. Psychology can go a long way...
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by JackFavell »

Thank you for replying to my questions, Mr. Epstein. I absolutely have to get your book! It's in the works as we speak. :D

That's fascinating about Ford and Marvin... I can see the two of them as almost mirror images of one another, they sound so very much alike, both tough tough men on the outside, but artistic and anxiety driven on the inside. I know we are on the subject of Marvin, but is there anything else about Ford or Woody Strode you can tell us?

You've talked about Marvin writing, helping script The Wild Bunch (oh what a movie, and yet I can't help wondering what it would have been like with Marvin, WOW), did he do any writing on any other films? Was he in on the creative process on Point Blank for instance?

Although I have a male character's name here, I am a woman, and I'm curious about Marvin's relationships with women. I'm also very curious if there are any stories about Gloria Grahame? Jeanne Moreau? He and Jeanne Moreau are so tender together.

Are there any stories about the making of Bad Day At Black Rock? I'd also love to hear about Hell in the Pacific.
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Rita Hayworth »

Mr. Epstein,

Thank you for your insightful explaination of the questions that I gave you to respond to. I understand very clearly what you've said and looking forward reading your book someday. I have a friend that orders books for me and she pretty much get any book that I want. I will get her a copy of your book from her. I love reading autobiographies of famous people that in the spotlight ...

One more question,

He did a lot of television work in his career and what (a two part question) ... What Television Series that he enjoyed the most and What Television Series that he did not enjoy the most :?:
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

movieman1957 wrote:Marvin was one of the most gifted "bad guys" on the big screen. I often marvel at how down right mean he could be. I'm not too familiar with much of his TV work, being large enough early on, (I have seen the first season of "M Squad") how would you say his film persona and his TV persona were, if at all, different?

Also with John Ford choosing him for "Valance" and "Donovan's Reef" so close together is there anything significant behind his selection for those films or did they just have a fine time and carry it on?
Great question about Lee Marvin's TV persona. I can tell you that his persona on TV is so different than the first full half of his film career that I chose to write about his TV work in one separate chapter to make the point. In other words, his level of versatility on TV was so great it required its own chapter to focus on it. He of course played villains on TV as he did on film but I was amazed when I discovered how many truly sympathetic characters he played early on in both episodic and anthology shows. He was not alone of course in that regard as frequent costars such as Charles Bronson also were more sympathetic on TV than in films of the same period. Their looks of course had a lot to do with it. On the big screen such extreme features might be more frightening, while on the small screen, they came across as more average Joes, the guy you work with or see on the street everyday. On TV Marvin was extremely believable in playing everything from a Harvard professor (The Psychophonic Nurse) to a Lenny Bruce styled nightclub comedian (The Joke's On Me). Of course, his best performances on TV, as on film, was usually in uniform. He earned an Emmy-nomination as a mentally-disturbed Marine in People Need People but was even more impressive as Marine hero Ira Hayes in director John Frankenheimer's TV special The American. Interestingly, real-life combat Marine Lee Marvin never played one on film but did so at least twice on TV!
As the culture began to change in the 60s, so did film audience's willingness to accept more non-traditional handsome actors in leading roles. By the mid to late 60s, Marvin was able to prove his versatility on film as he had on TV which was fine by him since he hated the rushed schedule and commercialism of television.
As to his back-to-back films for Ford, it was pure happenstance and Marvin always considered himself lucky to be able to have worked with Ford, even if it was toward the end of the great director's career. I discovered an interesting story about Liberty Valance before it even went into production in which Marvin was genuinely afraid that Ford was going to replace him even before filming his first scene and with good reason. If you're familiar with the movie, you'll notice Marvin's first scene has half of his face completed covered by a bandana. There's a very good reason for it and to find out why, ya gotta read my book :D
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