Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

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Dwayne Epstein
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

Sue Sue Applegate wrote:Thanks for that wonderful insight, Dwayne.

I was wondering if you had any other personal comments about Woody Strode that might not be related to his relationship to Lee Marvin, and also could you discuss your interviews with Alvy Moore? I think it is so interesting how familiar he was with Lee and his family.
Sue Sue Applegate wrote:Thanks for that wonderful insight, Dwayne.

I was wondering if you had any other personal comments about Woody Strode that might not be related to his relationship to Lee Marvin, and also could you discuss your interviews with Alvy Moore? I think it is so interesting how familiar he was with Lee and his family.
Oh, I could again risk writer's cramp in my attempts to convey all the wonderful things told to me by both Woody Strode and Alvy Moore, even more so on a personal level. Woody especially had a key fondness for Lee Marvin. SInce almost everything Woody told me about he and Marvin went in the book, I thought it might be cool to cut & paste a little of the transcript from my interview with Woody that did NOT go in the book as it gives a pretty good indication of their relationship. I'd like to preface it by saying if readers are easily offended, they should avoid reading this as it's pretty raw:
"When I did my first western in Italy, had to be around ‘70, ‘72, somewhere in there. I was getting $5,000 a week for ten weeks. I ain’t never seen that kind of money. I called him from Europe...I told Lee, 'I finally got to the money.' Now, I stayed in Europe for years. I came home and I hadn’t seen Lee for about four years. I got a job in New Mexico called The Gatling Gun. By now, I got a Mercedes. The good life had touched me. I called Lee. I said, 'Lee, I’m working in New Mexico and I’m coming to see you when I finish.' We finished the picture. I didn’t let him know I was driving a Mercedes. Well baby, it took a couple of days to get there. I parked out in front of the house in Tucson. I honked the horn. He come out saying, 'Who the hell is honking that horn?' He come outside and I said, 'Hello, you son-of-a-b****. You see what I’m driving? I got to the fucking money, in a foreign country.' That’s the type of relationship we had. By then he had separated from the wife who kicked me out of the house....So, we had our little weekend. Pamela [Lee's wife as of 1971] didn’t know me like that but she heard about me. When I got there, a writer from Australia was doing an article on Lee Marvin. He saw our relationship and said, 'You guys are like brothers.' I been in Europe almost four years and he ain’t seen me in years. I’m in a Mercedes, got a little bank account. It made him feel real good."

See what I mean? He was such a GREAT interview! On a personal level, as you asked, I can add that after interviewing Woody I got in contact with cult director Budd Boetticher who had worked with Lee and when he I told him I interviewed Woody, he asked me to put him in contact with Woody as he hadn't seen him in years. Woody did indeed pass away shortly thereafter and Budd died a few years after that. In a small way I like to think I helped two old friends reconnect before it was too late.
Dwayne Epstein
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

Lzcutter wrote:Mr. Epstein,

Quick question for you regarding the palimony suit and Michele Triola. Was she close to actor Dick Van Dyke when she was with Lee?
I never got to interview Michele Triola but I can tell you that she wasn't involved with DIck Van Dyke when she was with Lee, as far as I know. Her relationship with Van Dyke began when her lawyer, Marvin Mitchelson, got her a job with a talent agent as a secretary, which is how she met Van Dyke, one of the agent's clients. I learned all that from Vand Dyke's recent memoir which is a pretty good read.
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

MissGoddess wrote:
One of the aspects sadly missing in many films today in which filmmakers feel it necessary to hold the audience's hand and explain everything as if we were all twelve-year-olds. In Point Blank, you either get it or you don;t and I personally prefer such storytelling techniques.


Personally, I think one could say that about Lee's career. I get it! I get it! Love him.

Thanks for sharing your stories and insights on Lee's work and relationships with Strode and Ford.

Can you tell me how he felt about doing westerns vs. other genres? Did he enjoy them? some very famous cowboy actors hated horses so it wouldn't surprise me to hear he didn't care about them one way or another. I just think he was one of the most arresting villains in westerns. He seemed, as Ford beautifully cast him in The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, the embodiment of the "wildness" of the west, a violence that could not be caged. Killed, maybe, not caged.

Anything on how he got along with Wayne? They have great chemistry together in their brief scenes in The Comancheros. Like Howard Hawks once said, you needed real stature to stay in a scene with Wayne and Lee had that in spades.

Did you learn anything about how he felt about director Fritz Lang?

I've been exploring more and more vintage TV and have enjoyed bumping into Lee along the way. It was especially amusing and rather touching to see him and Richard Boone, two western bad boys, in "Medic"---playing such nice boys. :D

Thanks for being here.

---April
Thank you, April. That was very well said. Before I go on I'd like to say that the level of questions being asked in this forum are impressing the heck out of me! You folks are real movies, aren't you?? Kudos to you all!
As to Lee and Westerns in general, I think he enjoyed them very much since like most men he played cowboys & Indians as a child and being actor allowed him to do it in real life. As a little boy, his favorite writers were adventure writers of the frontier, like Robert Service, Bret Harte and Jack London. As an actor he of course enjoyed that aspect of his work and it showed but it was also very important to him to make his scenes beleivable. You would not necessarily see Lee do some of things in a western that say John Wayne or Randolph Scott would do, even though he worked with both of them several times. Lee could entertain and be beleviable at the same time, as in Liberty Valance or Seven Men From Now. Marvin wasn't crazy about horses but he learned how to ride from a friend of his in Texas he knew in the Marines. As to your comments concerning Liberty Valance, I could not add to that as you nailed it right on the head! I can say that of all the westerns he made Monte Walsh was his personal favorite and if you've ever seen it, you could see why...
He and John Wayne had great chemistry together and it shows in all 3 films they made. I like what Lee's wife Betty said about them, that John Wayne was like a big lumbering bear and Lee was a stalking panther ready to pounce. Together they way a perfect compliment for each other.
As to Fritz Lang, Lee had a great deal respect for him and if you read the book there's an anecdote in there that shows how he exhibited it in his own unique style which is one of my favorite Lee Marvin anecdotes.
Oh and Lee and Richard Boone worked together several times on TV and got along wonderfully. John Frankenheimer told me he was afraid they would get drunk together when they rehearsing a live TV show Frankenheimer directed called Bail Out at 30,000 Feet. Luckily they did not drink together during that show but they did run off and race their sports cars up and down Sunset Blvd when the should have been rehearsing...
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Rita Hayworth »

Dwayne Epstein wrote: Any man who could rise to the rank of the 1st SGT in the UMSC, such as your uncle, has my respect as it is the most arduous branch of the armed services. Most of what Wikipedia wrote about Marvin's war experience is accurate if not just a little overly general. He was wounded on Saipan but the wound ALMOST severed his sciatic nerve. It may seem petty but truth be told, if his sciatic nerve had been severed, Marvin would not have been able to walk. He also made 2o landings with 'The Fighting 4th' before Saipan which is an amazing number! In my book, I allowed Marvin himself to recount those days in the service from training to combat via letters he wrote home at the time and it really is quite astonishing to hear it in his own words.
Thank you for your kind words here.

And, addition information regarding Lee Marvin's WW2 Service and Injury ... and share them by writing them.

One more thing thanks for sharing your insights of Lee Marvin ... he is quite a character and one of my favorite actors as well. I'm looking forward reading your book someday ... I find your knowledge of Mr. Marvin refreshing and candid.

Thanks Again!
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by JackFavell »

I loved your stories about Woody Strode! I am a huge Strode and John Ford fan, so this is just icing on the cake!

Mr. Epstein, I just want to say that this has been one of my very favorite Q&A's, first of all because Lee Marvin is such an interesting and layered personality, but also because you have been so entertaining! It's lovely to talk to someone who really cares and is excited about his subject. All of this adds up to a great experience for us, and I hope for you as well. I can't wait to delve into your book. It's been a long time since I got excited about a bio, but I can assure you, I am truly looking forward to getting my copy after having this discussion. I hope if you have any time, you will make yourself welcome here and come back for a chat now and then. We'd love to have you!

One last question or two please? You mentioned that Marvin was friends with stunt man Tony Epper. Did he ever do his own stunts, or was he ever considering working as a stunt man? I imagine it would have depended on his war wounds and how extensive his recuperation was. He seems at one and the same time a city type, and an outdoorsman. What were his other hobbies, besides sport fishing and poker?

I'm still trying to picture Marvin, Alvy Moore and Keenan Wynn together... what a combination! Have you got any stories of their times together? :D Any more stories of Lee and Richard Boone?
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

JackFavell wrote:I loved your stories about Woody Strode! I am a huge Strode and John Ford fan, so this is just icing on the cake!

Mr. Epstein, I just want to say that this has been one of my very favorite Q&A's, first of all because Lee Marvin is such an interesting and layered personality, but also because you have been so entertaining! It's lovely to talk to someone who really cares and is excited about his subject. All of this adds up to a great experience for us, and I hope for you as well. I can't wait to delve into your book. It's been a long time since I got excited about a bio, but I can assure you, I am truly looking forward to getting my copy after having this discussion. I hope if you have any time, you will make yourself welcome here and come back for a chat now and then. We'd love to have you!

One last question or two please? You mentioned that Marvin was friends with stunt man Tony Epper. Did he ever do his own stunts, or was he ever considering working as a stunt man? I imagine it would have depended on his war wounds and how extensive his recuperation was. He seems at one and the same time a city type, and an outdoorsman. What were his other hobbies, besides sport fishing and poker?

I'm still trying to picture Marvin, Alvy Moore and Keenan Wynn together... what a combination! Have you got any stories of their times together? :D Any more stories of Lee and Richard Boone?
Thank you VERY much for your kind words. That's very thoughtful and refreshing to see. Seriously. I'm so used to seeing snarky comment on the 'net it kind of throws me a little to read warm & courteous comments so thanks again!

Your question about Lee Marvin and stunt work is another good one as I put the same one to Tony Epper when I interviewed him. I should add that Epper came from a stunt family dynasty as his father and fellow siblings were all stunt people (including sister Jeanne who doubled for Lynda Carter's Wonder Woman). If you've ever seen The Professionals, Epper is the one who does the long tumble down the canyon wall after Burt Lancaster shoots him. He was a pretty impressive guy who sadly succumbed to cancer last year. Anyway, when I asked him if he ever heard of of his friend Lee Marvin doing his own stunts, Epper said,"Yeah, he do a lot of fight scenes. He fell down some stairs one night. No movie. He was coming out of bar with me. It would have killed anybody else. He'd brush himself off with that look he'd gets about him, you know? You'd say, 'Buddy, what happened?' He'd say, 'Nope, nope, didn't hurt me.' Sat down, grab the bottle, glug, glug, glug and go 'Ahh!' That was Lee." Hope that answer the question.
Marvin was raised mostly in the city, being born in New York, but throughout his childhood he spent time in more rural environs in upstate New York, New Jersey and Florida. It created a permanent love of the outdoors as he fished and hunted, and later rode motorcycles with Keenan Wynn in his off-screen pursuits. Marvin always preferred to live in places where he was more in contact with nature, such as the beach at Malibu (where he also surfed on occasion) and then later moved to the desert in Tucson where he raised cactus and painted.

The combination of Marvin, Wynn and Alvy Moore may seem a strange one, I grant you but I don't think they all hung out together a lot. Alvy Moore and his wife Carolyn were friends & neighbors of Lee and his wife, as well as several other young actors starting out in the '50s so they all socialized together. In fact, Moore told me that when Lee's wife Betty was pregnant, he and several other threw a baby shower...for Lee! Don't you just love the image of that?

Unfortunately, RIchard Boone passed in 1981, long before I started the book, even before Lee passed away, so I never had the opportunity to speak to him. Publicist Peter Levinson knew Boone and told me a funny story about him that I didn't put in the book as again, it didn't involve Lee. Levinson told me that Boone's agent was frantic looking for him once as the actor disappeared when he was needed for work. The rumor was that Boone had gotten married and when his agent finally found him he was hung over in a bar somewhere in Hawaii. The agent asked Boone if it were true he had gotten married. The bleary-eyed Boone pointed over to a huge football-player-sized gentleman sleeping in the corner with a wedding veil on his head. Boone smiled and growled to his agent, "It's a shame you missed it because he made a beautiful bride." This story is probably more apocryphal than true but hey, it made me laugh and now I have the chance to share it!
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by JackFavell »

Oh my gosh, that's hilarious! I could picture Boone saying that and almost hear his deep growly voice. Thanks so much.

I just started reading your book. The story you tell at the very beginning, about Lee Strasberg is AMAZING. I don't know too many actors who would do what Marvin did. I very much am enjoying your writing, it's personal without overpraising the subject. You just seem to tell it like it is, and then back it up with a quote or a fact or an interview. I am especially intrigued by some of the quotes so far, one to Strother Martin about acting, and another about being alone in battle (or the world), and the word HELP being the last thing that anyone will respond to. I already start to get a picture of Marvin, 'the guilty puritan'.

Thanks again!
Dwayne Epstein
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

JackFavell wrote:Oh my gosh, that's hilarious! I could picture Boone saying that and almost hear his deep growly voice. Thanks so much.

I just started reading your book. The story you tell at the very beginning, about Lee Strasberg is AMAZING. I don't know too many actors who would do what Marvin did. I very much am enjoying your writing, it's personal without overpraising the subject. You just seem to tell it like it is, and then back it up with a quote or a fact or an interview. I am especially intrigued by some of the quotes so far, one to Strother Martin about acting, and another about being alone in battle (or the world), and the word HELP being the last thing that anyone will respond to. I already start to get a picture of Marvin, 'the guilty puritan'.

Thanks again!
Thank YOU for your kind words regarding my work. Nothing pleases an author more then knowing the point he is trying to make is getting across to the reader and that they appreciate it. It does my heart good! :D
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Sue Sue Applegate »

Dwayne, we also are quite fond of character actors here at The Silver Screen Oasis, and I've reviewed your extensive list of interviews that you have conducted in preparation for Lee Marvin: Point Blank, and I was hoping to find out a little more about some of them if you have any stories you'd love to share with us.

We have a thread specifically devoted to "Your Favorite Character Actors" here : http://silverscreenoasis.com/oasis3/vie ... =22&t=6050

I noticed on your list of contacts for interviews, of which there are over 100, names like Henry Beckman, Frank Cady, Michael Callan, James Doohan, Beverly Garland, L.Q. Jones, Burt Kennedy, Paul Picerni and John Mitchum. Any stories about these actors that you might like to share? We'd love it!
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Dwayne Epstein
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

Sue Sue Applegate wrote:Dwayne, we also are quite fond of character actors here at The Silver Screen Oasis, and I've reviewed your extensive list of interviews that you have conducted in preparation for Lee Marvin: Point Blank, and I was hoping to find out a little more about some of them if you have any stories you'd love to share with us.

We have a thread specifically devoted to "Your Favorite Character Actors" here : http://silverscreenoasis.com/oasis3/vie ... =22&t=6050

I noticed on your list of contacts for interviews, of which there are over 100, names like Henry Beckman, Frank Cady, Michael Callan, James Doohan, Beverly Garland, L.Q. Jones, Burt Kennedy, Paul Picerni and John Mitchum. Any stories about these actors that you might like to share? We'd love it!
Wow, Christy! You keep bringing up subjects that would take me a month to respond to as the stories these great film veterans told me (as well as the situations in which they were told!) would fill a book itself! One of my favorites was the aformentioned Beverly Garland. What a sweet, classy lady! I was in the midst of finishing up an interview with someone else when she walked over to me, asked if I was the gentleman doing the book on Lee Marvin, grabbed my arm pulled me over to a set of chairs sat us both down and proceeded to tell me the anecdote that I put in the chapter about Lee's TV work. The story literally had me holding my sides with laughter. While I was still laughing, she got up and said, "There! Now you have my Lee Marvin story," and then walked away. What a great lady she was!

James Doohan was another great interview situation in that I happened to catch him while he was in L.A. for a Star Trek Reunion TV special. He had known Lee very well during their early days as actors Woodstock NY. Most of what he told me went in the book but when he learned his wife was going to be running late in meeting him at the hotel bar, he proceeded to buy us round after round until I can now honestly say, I had Scotch with Scotty and got the drunken lowdown on the crew of the Starship Enterprise!

Henry Beckman gave me some interesting background on making Death Hunt which was helpful but refused to go on record about Lee Marvin as he had a specific reason for not liking the gentleman and chose not to discuss it, which I respected.

Frank Cady went way out of his way to provide important information regarding the stage work he did with Lee, and the story he provided showed a warm and generous side to Lee Marvin very rarely spoken of by most folks who knew him.

John Mitchum? Robert's kid brother (who played the mormon in Paint Your Wagon) was just as much a rascal as his more famous sibling has been rumored to be and told some great tales about working with Lee. Actually, the same can be said of virtually all the people I interviewed, which has kind of created a motto for what I do: There is no greater job in the world for me than talking to people who's work I admire, about the work I admire!
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Sue Sue Applegate »

Thank you so much for your response to the questions concerning character actors. Wonderful!

We also had a visit from Robert Ryan's daughter, Lisa. Her archived thread can be read here: http://silverscreenoasis.com/oasis3/vie ... =36&t=2658

Since you conducted interviews with Cheyney, Mitch and Lisa Ryan, do you have any stories about Mr. Ryan that you might like to share? Also, personally, what is your critique of Bad Day At Black Rock?
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Lzcutter »

Mr. Epstein,

Good afternoon! I grew up in Las Vegas back in the day when The Professionals was being filmed nearby in the Valley of Fire. The cast was stayed at the Mint Hotel and Casino on Fremont Street. Across the street from the Mint was the Pioneer Club with the talking neon cowboy sign, Vegas Vic. The story we always heard was that Lee Marvin got tired of hearing Vegas Vic saying,"Howdy, Pardner" every few minutes in the middle of the night and one day he enlisted Woody Strode's help. They took some bows and arrows from the prop department. One night, Lee and Woody started shooting arrows at Vic and the next day complained about the cowboy's voice.

Soon after, Vic's voicebox was disabled and the neon guy has not talked since.

I was wondering if you had any insight about this!

Thanks,

Lynn
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

Sue Sue Applegate wrote:Thank you so much for your response to the questions concerning character actors. Wonderful!

We also had a visit from Robert Ryan's daughter, Lisa. Her archived thread can be read here: http://silverscreenoasis.com/oasis3/vie ... =36&t=2658

Since you conducted interviews with Cheyney, Mitch and Lisa Ryan, do you have any stories about Mr. Ryan that you might like to share? Also, personally, what is your critique of Bad Day At Black Rock?
I did read the thread Lisa responded to and found it VERY interesting. Her father was an amazing actor and sadly underrated both then and now. He is having a rennaisance of course due to the resurgence of noir but as I said to Lisa, her father was so much more versatile than the noir fans are paying homage to him for.
Mitch Ryan, by the way, is not related to Robert Ryan and his family. I interviewed Mitch since he worked with Lee in Monte Walsh and he did so brilliantly. Some folks may remember better from the TV show Dharma & Greg in which played Greg's father. He also used to be on Dark Shadows back in the day. Anyway, Lisa did tell me a rather cute anecdote about Bad Day at Black Rock that anyone who hasn't seen the film shouldn't really read any further than right here.
Okay, spoiler alert taken care of: When she was about 12 years-old she was at a sleepover with some friends when they saw the TV Guide stated Bad Day at Black Rock was gonna be on. Having never seen it before, she called her father to tell him she was about to watch it and he told her, "I'm warning you, don't watch it. You'll be sorry...." Well, she proceeded to watch it with her friends and at the fiery climax she was grief-stricken seeing what happened to her father. When she called to tell her father, he said to her, "Didn't I tell you NOT to watch it?!"
As to my opinion of the film? I think it is an undeniable and unqualified classic that has laid the foundations for so many other films of equal and lesser value made since.
I'd like to add just one other thing: In Lisa Ryan's thread about her father, she mentioned that like many folks, Jason Robards would have been better in the part of Hickey instead of Lee Marvin in O'Neill's The Iceman Cometh. I must politely disagree. Director John frankenheimer told me he had his choice of casting any actor he wanted in the part and the first one crossed off his list was Robards. Why? Since Robards had played the part so often and was so associated with the work of O'Neill at the time, Frankenheimer said directing Robards in the part would be as interesting as directing him to go to the bathroom. Frankenheimer was choosing between Marvin, Gene Hackman or Marlon Brando and added that secretly he hoped Marvin would take the role. Thankfully, he did and I believe it's one of his all-time best performances. Sorry, Lisa.
There, now I feel better :)
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Dwayne Epstein »

Lzcutter wrote:Mr. Epstein,

Good afternoon! I grew up in Las Vegas back in the day when The Professionals was being filmed nearby in the Valley of Fire. The cast was stayed at the Mint Hotel and Casino on Fremont Street. Across the street from the Mint was the Pioneer Club with the talking neon cowboy sign, Vegas Vic. The story we always heard was that Lee Marvin got tired of hearing Vegas Vic saying,"Howdy, Pardner" every few minutes in the middle of the night and one day he enlisted Woody Strode's help. They took some bows and arrows from the prop department. One night, Lee and Woody started shooting arrows at Vic and the next day complained about the cowboy's voice.

Soon after, Vic's voicebox was disabled and the neon guy has not talked since.

I was wondering if you had any insight about this!

Thanks,

Lynn
Indeed I do as I interviewed all the surviving participants of the infamous 'Robin Hood Party' as the local press dubbed it. Both stuntman Tony Epper and costar Woody Strode told me exactly what actually transpired that night and both said neither one had ever spoken on the record honestly about it before....except for during the palimony case for which Epper was asked to testify about it. Other than that, they both told the story for the first time and added some very humorous details Epper was not required to give under oath. What happened? Heh, heh. Ya gots to read pages 164-165 and then page 218 of Lee Marvin Point Blank!
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Re: Q & A for Dwayne Epstein, Author of LEE MARVIN, POINT BLANK

Post by Sue Sue Applegate »

Dwayne, you are shameless! But if I had written the book about Lee Marvin, I would keep promoting it, too. Your responses about Robert Ryan and Jason Robards are thoughtful, not reckless, and "agreeing to disagree" is just fine.

So glad you read her thread. Are there any other SSO Guest Star threads that you found particularly intriguing? Please feel free to share.
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