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Things have really gone downhill in a hurry!

Posted: May 17th, 2007, 9:00 am
by Hollis
Good morning all,

Ever since this site was created I've felt little if any need to post at or even visit, the TCM message boards. I paid an infrequent visit there just a few moments ago and I was appalled by how little most of the people doing the posting had to offer. It's as though 99% of the worthwhile submissions simply disappeared. I don't think it's coincidental that the decline in quality at TCM dovetails so perfectly with the advent and growth of this site. Doing a quick Google search for Classic Movies resulted in literally hundreds of matches and almost as many sites devoted to them. To this point, I had been unaware of just how incredibly popular these films really were. Not having the time to research all those many sites, would I be correct in assuming that many of them don't offer this kind of forum for fans to meet at and interact through? If so, that would go a long way toward explaining why things are the way they are. I think what amazed me as much as the lack of insight into the movies and the knowledge that so many of you folks have was the almost abject inability of people to express themselves clearly and get their points across. Maybe I've become spoiled by the high quality of writing that exists here and have lost patience with what passes for communication at TCM these days. I've heard others say that they similarly felt little motivation to post there when they can post here and now I know why. Take a look at the message boards at TCM and tell me what you think. Is it just me or have things really deteriorated to the point I think they have? It's hard to fathom that there isn't enough knowledge and writing skill to adequately serve both forums, but apparently there isn't! If you're at all like me, with more questions than answers and find yourself lurking in the shadows marveling at how much information is available to us, a site like this is an absolute Godsend. Besides, with so many of the more valuable contributors posting almost exclusively to this site (or at least seeming to) I don't know that the same question posed in both forums could be answered in both. I guess I should just say "Thank you" to all of you who have done such an excellent job of educating me.

Posted: May 17th, 2007, 9:05 am
by knitwit45
Hollis, I wish I was as eloquent as you are, but my feelings are the same. I just don't go over to The Other Site much anymore, because all the intelligent, informative posts are here. (I'm still scratching my head, trying to figure out why I was invited to join...maybe I'm the Token Idiot????)

Thanks for expressing my thoughts, too.


Posted: May 17th, 2007, 9:18 am
by movieman1957

I'm not sure we've met but let me tell you that there are no idiots here much less token ones. (If anything I actually feel as if I already have that job.)


You are quite wonderfully correct. I still visit the other board once in awhile and for the most part there seems to be little going on. Posts sometimes are many hours old. I'll still try and answer some information questions, but on the whole those that made the TCM everything it could be are generally here. I'm just flattered to be part of the group.

Top Token Idiot

Posted: May 17th, 2007, 9:39 am
by knitwit45
Thanks for the support! I guess we'll have to share the title?? But I don't ANSWER questions about the movies, I only ASK see, I AM the T.T.I.

Posted: May 17th, 2007, 10:03 am
by Vecchiolarry

I have come to that exact conclusion. The poor old TCM Message Board has been severely wounded.
All those past horrible postings from all the "you know who's" inflicted an injury and now we have 'the gay patrol' on there, who is certain that every movie star and their film characters were homosexual.

Well, poohey. This happened on the IMDb Message Board about 2 years ago and I left. Filth, swearing, threats and 'everybody was outted as gay'... What stupidity!!

I read and lurk now but seldom post anything anymore.

BTW, Chris and Nancy - you are neither one idiots; I tolerate no idiots in my life and I always appreciate you both...


Posted: May 17th, 2007, 10:24 am
by moira finnie
Wow, Larry,
I gave up on IMDb's message board, (for the most part), about the same time that you did because of the rampant "everybody's gay" stuff and the really insidious snobs who devour any newbies there who express an open-hearted fondness for anyone who's not a celebrated film artiste.

In answer to Hollis' original query, I find that the TCM boards are much calmer now, and, because few people can really trust one another's identity and attitude after all the furor, it is also rather lonely and lacking in spice, variety and real insight, though there are still a few interesting posters there and I won't completely stop posting on that site.

Re: There ARE No "Idiots" Here
I appreciate anyone who takes the time to share a piece of their mind here and value the variety of thoughts and experiences that everyone brings here, especially individuals such as yourselves. You need to remember that, in a sense, I and everyone else here only know you for the intellectual spark that you bring here. In a sense, this site exists to provide us with a delightfully equal opportunity to learn and share with one another our essential selves. I thank each of you inwardly every time I read your thoughtful and playful comments. It is I who should apologize for posting too much at times, since I let my enthusiasm for your mental company run away with me at times.

Posted: May 17th, 2007, 10:46 am
by Erebus
Hollis, I’m conflicted over this. What you say is as true as it is sad. While I congratulate everybody for creating this board and community, and I realize TCM Admin brought in on themselves by responding too late to the excesses there, it saddens that the mother board no longer has the benefit of the insight and opinions now available here only. I also realize that I wasn’t around for the “golden age” of the other board, and that I post so infrequently that it’s not as though I’m entitled to think I express an opinion possessing the credibility of one who might actually play a significant role in building a quality board. But many of you served as leaders to other TCMers who are either less mature in their familiarity with classic films (like myself) or are reluctant to offer worthwhile opinions in the absense of the context you helped to create.

In time TCM will have the opportunity to rebuild itself, but I can’t help wondering whether an ongoing tendency of this board to invite quality members as they emerge over there won’t have the effect of dooming the TCM board to a perpetual second class, more pedestrian, level.

Of course we cannot know how things will evolve. This place could grow too insular, leading to greater participation at the other board, or it could grow into what the TCM board should have been from the beginning, in part by recruiting from over there, almost as though they're the minor leagues identifying and building talent for this board. (Yes, I jest, in part.) And, as Moira says, it’s not as though people here intend to completely forego the other board.

The TCM board does suffer from a puzzling lack of administrative commitment, and not just in regard to policing offensive behavior, so maybe in critical respects it deserves its fate. The categories are stale, and the board technology is in serious need of an upgrade. TCM is sophisticated in so many respects and yet seems oblivious to the importance and potential of its web presence.

As I said, I’m conflicted. I think with time I will participate more here. For what it’s worth, I haven’t been feeling well for some time (seasonal allergies), so my enthusiasm for almost everything has been dampened.

Posted: May 17th, 2007, 11:05 am
by movieman1957
Larry and Moira:

Thanks for your kind words.

Posted: May 17th, 2007, 12:15 pm
by Lzcutter

I, too, have found TCM City almost a shadow of its former self but after almost eight months of various flame wars it's only natural that it would take a toll on the board and the participants.

I think a number of factors are in play:
1 A number of good posters became disillusioned by the lack of oversight by the WebAdmins there. Through PMs with many of the posters (who are posting here now), I know that many of us sent PMs to the WebAdmin and to [email protected] only to be seemingly ignored until it was almost too late. I think this left a bad taste with many and it will take time for them to come around.

2 The TCM board is going through a transistion. Many of us post in both places but summer is coming and the majority of posters have families and the summer months are for family vacations, longer days and less time in front of the computer.

3 The content wars of last year truly took a toll on the board. Every month it seemed we were arguing about whether or not TCM was going to the dogs. This seemingly never ending battle (like a wild fire, just when it seemed it was out for good, it would come back to life and begin raging again) also contributed to a number of long time posters opting out of the board.

It will be interesting to see where the TCM board goes from here. I suspect in some ways it will evolve over a longer period into a strong board again but for many it will never be the same.

Posted: May 17th, 2007, 12:21 pm
by bobhopefan1940
It is a shame about the Turner site, though I never have contribued much to the board. Rather I'm mainly a fangirl who goes around cheering for my favorite actors (and actress)... :lol: I've been over there recently, but only to respond in the Astaire thread and inglis' who are we all. I still hope it revives itself, even though this board is such a goldmine.

Re: No Idiots here

Posted: May 17th, 2007, 12:35 pm
by knitwit45
Wow, Moira, are you KIDDING????? I check the board daily, just to read your posts. I feel like I have a subscription to one of the best movie magazines ever written. Your insights and comments are always well thought out and NEVER too long. (now, can I borrow 5 bucks???)

Thanks for the kind words, Chris and Larry.

Larry, when are you going to start your reminisces thread? I love the stories of Nell, and her friends, and your "dates with the stars", even if you were only 5 years old at the time.


can we get a spell check button???? :oops:

Posted: May 17th, 2007, 1:07 pm
by Dewey1960
I poke my head in every now and then over at the TCM boards and, yes, it is extremely depressing there. I'm almost inclined to believe that it's worse now than it was when the final firestorm broke out a couple of months ago. And I am speaking as one who had his fair share of negative participation in that particular range war. (I still feel there are a number of folks who still associate me with "the nameless one" which is unfortunate, but such is the nature of life online.) But over there, a lot of nasty new faces seem to be dominating mean-spirited conversations about Garbo and precious little else. The only time anything interesting ever appears is when one of the Plastic Age people post. (Or BronxGirl48, who continues to be the most if not only interesting regular non-Refugee on their premesis!)
I think that gradually I will abandon it altogether. This site has everything the TCM boards once had and more. Namely thoughtful and intelligent posters who care about classic films and the people who made and continue to make them.

Posted: May 17th, 2007, 2:05 pm
by vallo
I still stop by there from time to time. And it is depressing. There are a few who never give up (Kudos to Mr. Mongo) And I'm sure it will pick up. Hopefully, after a while. Things slow down at times on all boards. So I wouldn't call in an Undertaker yet. I would have met any of you.


Posted: May 17th, 2007, 5:02 pm
by Rusty

Right now, all my time is taken up keeping tabs on a developer who is about to ruin my neighborhood and I'm making sure he files for all required permits...including a 404 permit allowing him to ruin a beautiful wetland (actually a very nice stream). I was hoping those huge birds nesting down in the wetlands were golden eagles. Alas, the birds are turkey vultures so they are not a protected species. So, the a-hole developer will probably get the permits to build his damn bridge across the stream and ruin the primary reason I moved into this dump.

Oh, but I'm going to make that developer pay...big time...when he buys my property. Oh, time.

Whew...sorry for my long winded reply, but that is what I have been doing the last couple of weeks. I have not had time to look at movie related stuff.

I did look at TCM forums yesterday and I noticed a programming challenge in progress. I think the programming challenge is a good topic. I will look at the programming challenge every other day.


Posted: May 17th, 2007, 6:47 pm
by Mr. Arkadin
Unfortunately there are not that many people there who want to discuss film. The poster Larry and others have mentioned is more of a troublemaker than some of the people who were banned. It's not about sharing information or learning--it's about people's agendas and their quest for dominance over the board and others. I agree that Bronxgirl is one of the only interesting posters (besides people from this board) there right now.

One thing I enjoy about this board is the depth of the members. Everyone is passionate about film and everyone has something to contribute. If I want to know about a certain film or genre, there are 2 or three people steeped in that area that know it inside and out and can guide me to the good stuff or analyze a film and give me three different interpetations.

On top of it all, people are kind show common curtesy. People speak their minds more and go in depth on their views because they know it's not going to start some 8 page flame war. I am very glad to be here and enjoy each of your views. You guys are the best (I do miss that spellcheck though...)!