Crime on film and the Criminals that inspired the writing.

[Western Guy]

Speaking of Bonnie & Clyde, does anyone remember this:

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[ChiO]

Or the glorious tunes from the soundtrack:
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[JackFavell]

Yeah! I'm a huge fan of Flatt and Scruggs.

[RedRiver]

I've liked bluegrass as long as I can remember. Before BONNIE AND CLYDE; maybe even before the man named Jed and the bubbling crude! That's cutting it close. I was awfuly young!

[charliechaplinfan]

these are nothing like British jails.

Is there something you'd like to share with the group, Allison?

Ha ha, I should be careful about what I write. No, I'm not an exciting criminal type, I just the kind who likes a good crime drama, the look of our prisons on screen is very different to the Warner's prison set or Alcatraz. Alcatraz was a creepy place to look around, I really felt like I was standing on a film set, it might have been used in films but to be jolted back to reality and realise that although it's a tourist haven now it's held some of the toughest criminals in American history and has had a very chequered history. It's not a place that fades from the memory.

[Western Guy]

Speaking of soundtracks, I'd nominate as the best the LP (remember those?) DILLINGER. Lots of great music representative of the era. Have the DVD of the movie but wish I'd hung onto the record.

Have never been to Alcatraz but a girl friend of mine lives on the San Francisco coast and has been there a couple of times and says that the place does have a very eerie ambience. Well, look at the occupants: Capone, Machine Gun Kelly, Alvin Karpis, Doc Barker, Robert Stroud, who was NOT the nice guy as portrayed by Boit (not a spelling error) in the biopic. Stroud actually was a very terrifying psychotic fellow - and this comes from Karpis himself who generally would not speak badly about his fellow criminals unless he had a good reason. He knew Stroud and basically admitted that if he'd served on the prison parole board he never would have recommended setting The Birdman free.

Speaking of which, the movie makes an error when the tour guy mentions that one of the Alcatraz inmates was Baby Face Nelson. Uh-uh. Nelson never did time on The Rock - although he may have had he been captured alive and escaped the death penalty.

[charliechaplinfan]

Which movie Stone? Is it The Rock, I never did get to the end of that movie. I've never watched The Birdman of Alcatraz although I've seen a film with Clint Eastwood in, is that Escape From Alcatraz and I've seen the cell with the dummy in the bed. I remember the tour being so interesting, I think it was a recorded tour rather than a tour guide, then we had a chance to wander around. I think we were in San Francisco for about 5 days and I enjoyed everywhere I went, I could see so many films in those streets but Alcatraz, it sits in the bay, when it was a prison it must have been a constant reminder to the locals that some of the most dangerous criminals were not too far away.

[RedRiver]

This is all most interesting. The one and only time I've visited San Francisco (Loved it!), I elected not to see Alcatraz. I've spent enough time trying to stay OUT of jail. I had no desire to tour one! Now I wish I'd reconsidered. I had a wonderful time walking across the bridge. Tried to nab a ride back on a tour bus. "Nope! We only take our own party." Great. I have to walk across the bridge again!

I like prison dramas too. I don't think I've ever seen one that wasn't fun on one level or another. Institutions in general provide fuel for storytelling. Hospitals, military bases, schools. I'm not sure why that is. Should I know THE ROCK? What is that?

[Western Guy]

Alison, the movie where the error regarding Baby Face Nelson is made is THE BIRDMAN OF ALCATRAZ.

ESCAPE FROM ALCATRAZ is a good film, based on a supposed true event. THE ROCK, however, is . . . dare I say, crap.

[charliechaplinfan]

The Rock, starring, if my memory serves me well, Sean Connery and Nicholas Cage, it was crap. A friend insisted we watch it after we returned from San Francisco, how a bad film could be made about that place I don't know but this one was it.

The Birdman of Alcatraz, I'm going to have to watch it, I remember when we toured the author of a book about The Birdman was there, she portrayed him as a very lonesome and quiet man, the wrong type to be locked up there, you've scotched that Stone.

[Western Guy]

Despite Robert Stroud's dedication to ornithology, he was a deeply disturbed and frightening man. When his moods would shift he'd fly off into violent tangents, threatening the guards by describing the most horrific crimes he would commit towards their wives and (especially) children. I confess I very much enjoy the Boit Lancaster biopic, but the subject of the film was in truth a repulsive human being.

[RedRiver]

I do remember hearing about THE ROCK. I thought we were talking about a real movie!

[charliechaplinfan]

What was Robert Stroud's original crime Stone, do you know? It sounds like Hollywood sanitised him for the screen.

[Western Guy]

Here's the link, Alison. Make of it what you will:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Stroud

[charliechaplinfan]

Thanks, I've read it, he doesn't sound like anyone I'd like to meet in a dark alley. The old adage is that even Hitler had his good point, he liked dogs, well Stroud liked and was kind to birds, can't see anything else in there pointing towards any other good point.