George Raft

[charliechaplinfan]

I know and then that's almost how he is remembered, as the guy who gave Bogart his break. It's as if we've come full circle. I'm really looking forward to watching some more of his movies but I have to wait for them to arrive, it's been a long time since I watched They Drive By Night, so I'm planning to watch it again over the next few days, maybe Bolero too. I first saw him in Some Like It Hot, many years ago, before I became a serious film fan, of course I didn't appreciate who he was but felt he really looked the part, once I knew who he was, it's ingenious casting. Edward G Robinson would he have been cast as Napoleon, they guy who gets spats gunned down? Again I see an inside joke, knowing how particular Raft was about clothing, Spats is mad about his spats.

Something you might not be able to help me on, one of the henchmen in Some Like It Hot, has a strong accent and looks like he might have been a price fighter and he utters the like 'Buttermilk' he's also a gangster in Guys And Dolls. I've never known who he was but my guessing is he was probably one soft guy who always got to play the tough guys. I think he's called Harry Wilson and he's so recogniseable. From my description do you think it's the right guy, there's a couple listed as Spat's henchmen?

[charliechaplinfan]

I found this image of the Manpower fight, it very much looks like Edward G Robinson was the agressor although the studio took his side, Ward Bond looks like he's enjoying his ringside seat. I apologise I'm no good at embedding pictures but here's the link

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?q=edward ... 2,s:0,i:76

[knitwit45]

here ya go, Ali!

[Western Guy]

That's the pic, and doesn't Eddie look p****d. Definitely one photo I'd like to have had in my book. That fight always upset Eddie because he said in all his years in movies it was the only time he ever had a physical confrontation with anyone and that he was looking forward to working with George on the picture. Having appeared with other Warner "toughs" such as Bogart, Cagney and Garfield, he didn't expect any problems with Raft, with whom he had already appeared in a tough guy routine in some stage show.

And yeah, never noticed it before, but doesn't Ward Bond look as if he's enjoying the show . . .

And yep CCF, Harry Wilson is the fella you describe. Perfect casting for a neanderthal role (no disrespect intended, he just had that almost Rondo Hattonish-look). And of course Mike Mazurki was the other notable Spats henchman - and believe me, Mike was a sweet, gentle giant with a brilliant mind. Funny guy, too.

P.S. Thanks knitwit for posting. And CCF, I'll call you Ali if you call me Stone.

[knitwit45]

Take that back, WG!, I ain't no softy!!!!





Who you talkin' about, WG? Does that stand for WIZE GUY?????

[Western Guy]

Again, many thanks for your clever photo postings, knitwit. My laugh of the day. Two of the toughest mugs in Hollywood at the time. But Mike really was an educated softy. Met him when he appeared in Winnipeg as the guest speaker at the Ukrainian Professional Businessman's dinner (which the following year Jack Palance was scheduled to appear but had to bow out of due to a previous commitment).

[charliechaplinfan]

Nancy, thank you for your help with the photos. I don't think I've ever seen a behind the screens fist fight before and this one didn't only have A list contenders but a strong supporting cast.

Stone, thank you for your help with Harry Wilson and Mike Mazurki who I recognise from some noir movies I've watched. Harry Wilson has a face you can't help but see in a crowd, it's been a while since I watched Some Like It Hot, I think I over watched it years ago, it is my favourite comedy film of all time. You're welcome to call me Ali.

[Western Guy]

Thanks Ali, I'm sure you know my real name already from my book. And Nancy, the same with you as my reference. Still new enough on this board to not know our true names, but nice and particularly welcome that we can refer to each other by those.

Back to Some Like It Hot, from what Francesca Robinson told me, Eddie was to be cast in the role of Little Bonaparte. How great would that have been, to see him order George Raft's execution at the banquet, carried out by Eddie's son? Yet Nehemiah Persoff was good in the role. When I interviewed him for my Raft bio, he said he really didn't have much of a recollection of Raft other than he played his part with professionalism and seemed to be a guy very easy to get along with. Mike Mazurki told me that George was a pretty quiet fellow but when they did speak between takes, they mainly discussed sports.

Two notes of interest. Jack Lemmon was going to supply some information on Some Like It Hot (beyond what was mentioned in the wonderful Yablonsky bio) before he got sick. And Tony Curtis had agreed to supply the Foreward prior to his becoming ill with a serious case of pneumonia. Fortunately, I was able to secure the service of Alan K. Rode to step in, who provided a wonderful insight.

[charliechaplinfan]

I really like Tony Curtis, I always feel like I shouldn't because he's such a huge ego but he was funny with it. I can even forgive what he said about Marilyn. Jack Lemmon, another favourite, he neve rput a foot wrong for me. Tony Curtis did write a book with Mark Vieira about Some Like It Hot, I'll have a look through it to see if it says anything about George Raft that we don't already know.

I think Edward G Robinson ordering George Raft's murder would have been something.

Today I watched They Drive By Night, I marvel at the fact a film has 4 top ranking stars in it, would that happen these days? I know Humphrey Bogart wasn't top ranking at this point but the cast is about as good as Warner Brothers ever put together. I found the guys really believable as brothers, I haven't watched a Bogey picture in a few months and he always feels fresh when I watch him again, especially in his younger pictures, he doesn't have a great deal to do but he's undeniably Bogart. I want to give George Raft more credit than he would probably give himself, he's a good actor in a straight role and perhaps a better actor in a bad role. He fit the role like a glove, like with Man Power and certainly had chemistry with both ladies but that's not difficult given the ladies. If there was a bum note to the picture it was Ida's mad scene at the trial which seemed a little over done by today's standards and Alan Hale's character was a little too larger than life. How much story was packed into that 90 minutes, that's Warners for you.

It got me thinking of Warner's Murderer's Row, Muni, Cagney, Raft, Robinson, Bogart and Garfield. Was Errol Flynn the only non Murderer's Row leading man that they had? And Alan Hale? How hard working, he's in almost every Errol Flynn movie I can think of, he's in an awful lot of the Murderer's row pictures. He must have one of the longest screen credit lists in Hollywood.

[Western Guy]

Tony Curtis was . . . an interesting guy. In his later years he seemed to shift his opinion about working with Marilyn, speaking in more favorable terms. My buddy Mickey Knox who appeared with Tony in "City Across the River" wasn't very fond of Curtis and never even gives him a mention in his autobiography. Tony likewise isn't too flattering of Mickey or his other "City Across the River" co-stars in his book. Yet one thing I always kind of admired about Tony was when he was on a talk show and took questions from the audience, he'd always ask the person's name, which I think was to build up a kind of personal rapport with the questioner. Also, when he used to appear on "The Tonight Show" he (and Ernie Borgnine - another great guy, btw) were the only two guests who would first go over to shake Doc Severinson's hand. Always found that kind of classy.

As for "They Drive by Night", it's often been called George's best Warners film . . . but IMO, all of his Warner films are gems. Damn fool shoulda stuck with the studio. And that goes for Cagney and Bogart, too. Honestly, Warners provided them with the best material and it's hard for me to see how these fellas could not recognize that. Sure, there were some stinkers, but when you think of the great films of this trio, nearly 99.9% of the time you'll narrow in on the Warner films.

Here's an interesting point to consider about the Bogart "tough guy" pair ups. When he appeared with Cagney or Robinson, it was always as an adversary. Bogie's two team-ups with Raft have him as either a pal or brother. Really hope you get the chance to catch them in "Invisible Stripes" where Bogart IMO gives one of his toughest yet most sympathetic gangster performances pre-"High Sierra".

Ali, I will agree with you on Ida's mad scene as being . . . a bit much and it kinda strays a great picture a little off-course. Will disagree with you on Alan Hale, though. That fella brings a smile to my face everytime I see him. Even my wife, no classic movie buff, points out Hale whenever she watches an oldie on God's gift to us all, TCM.

BTW Ali, have you ever seen "Bordertown", of which "They Drive by Night" is a partial remake? Compare Ida's mad scene with Bette Davis's. Would love to know your thoughts.

[charliechaplinfan]

I have watched Bordertown yet I never connected the two films apart from the murder, I recognised that because it's so memorable. I much prefer Ida Lupino, I'm not Bette Davis's biggest fan, there's some good films but I find her too much to bear in some films. I'm rather partial to Ida Lupino, I think she was a fine actress. I hope I didn't give the impression that I don't like Alan Hale, he was a little too jokey in this one movie, he's one of my favourite supporting actors.

I agree about Cagney, Raft and Bogart with Warner Brothers. Didn't Cagney return to make White Heat? I wonder who was a bigger thorn in Jack Warner's side? Errol Flynn who wouldn't behave, Jimmy Cagney who wasn't above suing the studio, George Raft who turned down films and was difficult to handle or Humphrey Bogart who liked to gripe and whine but usually buckled under? Add to that Paul Muni, Olivia De Havilliand and Bette Davis, he had his work cut out.

Paul Muni is someone I flow hot and cold with too, he's either really good, Scarface, The Good Earth or a bit boring, Juarez. Luise Rainer was a hoot at the TCM festival describing working with Muni on The Good Earth, he sounded like a serious man.

Back to Some Like it Hot, I've had a look at my book and discovered a couple of titbits. Firstly, he was an absolute gentleman on set but refused to film the scene in the garage after Spats has had toothpick Charlie killed, Billy Wilder wanted George to kick the toothpick out of the mouth of the actor who was playing Toothpick Charlie who was lying on the floor, an actor who was blind. George refused to do the scene scared that he would hurt the actor. Wilder got furious and changed his trousers to ones matching Raft's, played the scene, kicked the actor in the face and landed him in hospital. The second fact, I absolutely love, the man they'd hired to teach Joe E Brown and Jack Lemmon to dance the tango wasn't up to the job, so George Raft stepped in and taught them how to tango properly. He also suggested to Billy Wilder that the movie should end with him and Marilyn tangoing off into the distance. As Tony Curtis said, a good ending but not for this movie.

[Western Guy]

Out of all the major Hollywood studios at the time, I think it's safe to say that Warners was the most acrimonious. If actors weren't fighting over salaries (Cagney), they were battling over roles (Davis). After the success of "Yankee Doodle Dandy", Jimmy Cagney left Warners with brother Bill to form Cagney Productions (which grew to be a truly family enterprise). The company enjoyed moderate success but failed miserably with their prestige project "The Time of Your Life", leading Jimmy to return to the old Warner homestead to film "White Heat" and later "Kiss Tomorrow Goodbye", which was another gangster film Cagney did not want to make but which helped pay off their significant losses from the Saroyan film.

I enjoy Paul Muni, though his acting style really seems out of date, dramatic readings, overdone facial expressions, flourishes and all. Still, I find him entertaining. He just never seemed to lose his stage mannerisms, like someone such as Eddie Robinson did, becoming right at home in the medium of film. But in "Scarface", "I Am a Fugitive from a Chain Gang" and a few others, I found Muni quite effective.

[CineMaven]

Hi Allison. It's so great you watched "They Drive By Night" and enjoyed it. I unequivocably and unqualifyingly LOVE it.

[charliechaplinfan]

Hey Theresa I'm glad I watched one of your favourite movies. I had seen it before but had forgotten just how good it was. Warner's didn't shy away from realism and when Bogart and Raft were out on the road they looked like they had kept those clothes on for weeks.

Stone, Edward G Robinson was a real revelation to me to watch, he's such a screen natural and he's made some terrific movies, still sometimes I feel a little sorry for him sometimes, he never really plays the guy who gets the girl. The films he made with Fritz Lang are my favourite. He could turn his hand to everything expect perhaps a romantic lead.

I have to respect Paul Muni and have enjoyed all his performances apart from Juarez, he was lost to me under his makeup. I haven't watched too many of his movies yet.

I was a little taken aback when flicking through the Some Like It Hot book, there's only a couple of pictures that show Raft, one like he appears on screen and another when he's coaching Joe E Brown and Jack Lemmon (the picture of Joe and Jack rehearsing is funny enough, Jack Lemmon looks quite a bit beefier that Joe E Brown) and I could swear it wasn't him because the guy in the picture is quite bald and not at all nattily dressed and I could have sworn from your book Raft kept his hair. So I get your book down off the shelf and see that he did lose his hair and I just couldn't remember. My memory Presumably to teach the guys to do the tango, George had to tango with Jack and Joe in turn, that would have been quite a picture.

[charliechaplinfan]

Stone I wanted to ask about the scene in They Drive By Night were George is credited with some nifty driving that saved the lives of Bogart, Ann Sheridan and himself. Is it the scene that is in the film? I'm so surprised that they would let their big stars do anything that would put them in danger. Is it something of Hollywood folklore? It is a great anecdote.