*CANDIDS*

[Western Guy]

Cool! You learn something new on this Board everyday. I never knew that two of my favorite comedians shared a birthday: Groucho and Bud Abbott. Tremendous fan of both these talented gents. Wonder how many people appreciate how truly funny Bud Abbott was. Certainly he was overshadowed by the more overt comic shenanigans of his partner, but Bud possessed his own subtle humor that I've really grown to appreciate as I have gotten older. In fact, whenever I watch an A&C movie I find I laugh more at Bud's actions and remarks than I do at Lou (though I love the fat little guy, too).

True story: Many, many years ago Bud Abbott was playing a show up here in Winnipeg. My dad loved going to the race track and I often went with him. On this particular night my dad pointed out Bud Abbott, who happened to be at Assiniboia Downs, apparently by himself, looking dapper in (if I remember correctly) a cream-colored suit. My dad told me to go over and ask for his autograph. Well, at the time I was only vaguely familiar with the name - and shy, to boot, so I passed. Did that three more times (with George Gobel, Vaughn Monroe and Canadian actor Douglas Rain). I think that was why I later got into interviewing celebrities . . . regretting those earlier missteps.

Darn, I would love to have gotten Bud Abbott's autograph!!

[mongoII]

Stone, there is no doubt that Bud Abbott was an essential part of the A&C duo. It is too bad that you didn't get up the nerve to get his autograph. I did the same thing with Debra Winger, Edie Adams and
Anette Funicello.

[Western Guy]

Gosh Joe, I know. If only to have that second chance. In your case, wonder what would have been the outcome with Miss Debra Winger. Geez, I've heard horror stories about her.

[pvitari]

My favorite Abbott and Costello picture. I'm sure you all can figure out why. :)

[mongoII]

Actually, Stone, I had plenty of chances with Miss Winger. I worked in the furniture dept. of a big department store in the Catskills, and I sold her a bed for her son Noah (Timothy Hutton's son). She was as sweet as pie and shook my hand after the sale (tiny hand). She came to the department many times after that and we talked about a movie she was making. She wore no makeup and looked swell.
Come to find out that she bought a home not far from me (she is still there). One day she even stopped at my garage sale and bought a Look magazine. When my wife thanked her for stopping by, she said "I make my rounds". After the department store closed I worked in an antique shop in the area and she stopped in to buy a rocking chair, and she said "I know you". Debra Winger was alright in my book.

[mongoII]

Who is that handsome coach driver, Paula?

[pvitari]

Three guesses, Joseph! ;)

[Western Guy]

That's always refreshing to hear, Joe. I know that Miss Winger has gotten a pretty bad rap from people, yet I always enjoyed her work and it's nice to know that in your experience you found her a decent sort. Celebs or not, they are still people, flesh, blood, virtues and foibles (with thanks to Jerry Lewis). Mucho thanks, Joe, for sharing the personal story.

BTW: Didn't that coach driver just come off the Rio Grande?

[charliechaplinfan]

I've always liked Debra Winger in movies but got the impression that her costars might not have felt the same way, I'm glad you got chance to know her Joe and find out that she was a nice human being. Perhaps she is more ordinary than some of the people who work in the film industry and just got a bad rap.

I know Abbott and Costello were huge in the States and in their time, were they as big there as Laurel and Hardy? Were they firm friends like L&H, it's the icing on the cake with L&H that they made so many classic comedies and comedy moments and had a tremendous respect for one another.

Jerry Lewis? Stone I've just picked his book up at a charity sale, it's about him and Dean Martin, now I do know that their relationship had it's ups and downs, I wondered if you could venture an opinion as to how Lewis might present the past with Dino not being around anymore, I think it's all nicey nicey about Dean but is Jerry the kind of guy to be truthful about himself? I think I remember that you said he never replied to you when you were doing research. I'll still read Lewis's book but would like to know if I need to put my tongue in my cheek before reading it.

[mongoII]

Victor Fleming directs Vivien Leigh in "Gone with the Wind"

[pvitari]

Stone, that coach driver had a few years to go before Rio Grande. :)

[ChiO]

I know Abbott and Costello were huge in the States and in their time, were they as big there as Laurel and Hardy? Were they firm friends like L&H,

According to The Abbott and Costello Book (1975) -- one of the first movie books I bought, and it is likely a bit biased toward the "I'm-a-fan-and-won't-write-anything-nasty" side -- the break-up was amicable. According to Costello, Abbott was just getting tired of working, but the act itself was getting tired and its popularity was on a downward trend. Some tiffs reportedly during their 20 years as a team (who wouldn't have tiffs during 20 years?): Costello was somewhat annoyed with Abbott's name coming first, and that initially Abbott got 60% of the take (when Costello demanded a 50-50 split, Abbott obliged).

The book also says that, at the time of the break-up, when Costello was asked what he would now do, he said he was going to team up with Dean Martin.

Judging "bigness" is tough. My sense is that they never enjoyed the critical acclaim of Laurel & Hardy, then or now. On the other hand, Abbott and Costello -- based on general popularity and money made and films made and appearance in other media (Broadway, radio, TV sit-com, TV variety show, cartoons)-- probably were bigger. Their bits still make me laugh and the appearances on the The Colgate Comedy Hour are fabulous (as were Martin & Lewis').

[Western Guy]

Here I go with my nagging namedropping again.

Chris Costello is a friend of mine and she takes exception with much of what was presented in the Bob Thomas book -- not with Thomas so much as what was reported to him through former A&C agent Eddie Sherman.

Eddie made it sound as if Costello commanded the team and played the Moe Howard role when it came to deals and terms, etc. True, Bud was generally the more complacent one in their relationship but he was nowhere near the pushover as presented in the Thomas book. Bud did have a problem with alcohol apparently brought about by his terrors of living with epilepsy and therefore possessed less of a competitive nature than his partner, but the breakup was not Bud's idea. He was not in a financial position to retire when the team split. The IRS came after both men with a vengeance, using them as an example, which kinda sucks when one considers all the war bonds the duo sold during WWII. Costello had his own health problems and by the 1950s was not physically able to put up with Bud's drinking and after one particularly bad Vegas experience finally told Bud that they'd best go their separate ways. Bud, ever agreeable, told Lou okay, that he'd try to work something out. Lou soloed and had some success, but, as with Bud, he was pretty much shadowed by the IRS and, with these pressures and rheumatic heart plaguing him, he finally died suddenly in 1959.

As to the eventual 50-50 split -- didn`t happen. Costello got big-headed and demanded 60-40 and Abbott grudgingly obliged. What Bud would not agree to was a change in billing. Nor would Universal. They bought Abboott & Costello`and Àbbott & Costello`the team would remain.

The Ben Johnson pic really surprises me. Had NO idea he`d ever appeared with A&C at any time. Again, this Board never fails to surprise a movie maverick such as myself ---

Darn you guys for tripping me up . . .

Alison, re: Jerry Lewis. Really know nothing about the truth behind their relationship. Jerry always says it was a big brother-little brother thing but I get the feeling Jerry quickly became a prima donna-pain-in-the a** early on and Dean (kinda like Bud Abbott but with more grit) finally couldn`t take it any longer and decided to move on to what eventually became greener pastures. Sadly Bud Abbott was too old and ill to have made the same move. He did one dramatic appearance on GE THEATRE (playing the manager of a comedian - played by Lee Marvin!) but returned - or tried to return to the old format by partnering with Costello-like comedians, such as Candy Candido.

[pvitari]

Stone, Ben appeared briefly in that one scene in The Naughty Nineties (1944) driving the coach up to the front of the saloon and then sitting there silently while Abbott and Costello go through their comic business standing up and stepping down from the cab. At one point he turns his head slightly towards them. ;)

That still is a posed picture though. In the movie, the shot where Abbott and Costello descend from the cab is filmed from the other side.

You can see screencaps from that one scene here: http://benjohnsonscreencaps.shutterfly.com/stunts/341

Here's one screencap to give you an idea. ;)

[Western Guy]

You know, I've read a couple of interviews with our Gentle Ben and never did he mention that he'd appeared in an A&C movie. In fact, I'm surprised to discover that he did a movie in 1944. Thought his screen debut came a few years later. Thanks much for the info and the link.