Copyright
As some of our members may enter the motion picture industry where they could be actors or actresses, directors, producers, screenwriters, novelists etc i.e. in some way involved with the creative arts, I thought it might be useful to provide them with at least a basic knowledge of copyright.
I am not an expert in this field, my expertise lies in patents and trademarks, nevertheless during the course of my career I have necessarily had to acquire some knowledge of copyright. For a definitive legal view one would have to consult a copyright lawyer and my advice is without prejudice. Although my advice relates to the UK and Europe I believe it is relevant to the US.
1. Copyright subsists i.e. exists in "artistic works". An artistic work includes written music, a musical performance, motion pictures and clips from motion pictures, paintings, drawings and literary works such as letters, emails, novels etc. Copyright does not subsist in ideas or notions, the idea must be reproduced in some tangible form. Ideas if valuable are best kept secret and only disclosed in confidence with an accompanying written confidentiality agreement.
2. Copyright provides the owner with the exclusive right to make copies of the work.
3. The artistic work may comprise virtually no artistic merit at all. For instance some scribble by a three year old child on a piece of paper may attract copyright protection because it could be seen as a drawing and drawings however simple are copyright.
4. It is not necessary to register a copyright work in the UK in order to secure copyright. Copyright protection arises automatically as soon as the work is completed.
5. The term of copyright is the lifetime of the author of the work from the date of completion plus 70 years. So in the case of our three year child, supposing he lives till he's 88 then copyright in his "work" would last for 155 years. That is why from the point of view of the copyright owner the younger the author the better.
6. The relatively favourable position of copyright protection has provoked some resentment in scientists and technologists. In their case their creative process produces inventions which can only be protected by patent (unless they include engineering drawings or software programs which would attract copyright). Patents are expensive because they are drafted and processed by lawyers and annual maintenance fees are payable and furthermore they only last twenty years. No maintenance fees are required for copyright works.
7. In order for copyright infringement or violation to be established it must be shown that there was actual copying i.e. evidence must be produced that the alleged infringer saw or even had in front of him the copyright work when he reproduced it. If it can be shown that the alleged infringer conceived of the work independently then there is no copying and no infringement. In patents in contrast it doesn't matter whether the invention was conceived independently if it falls within the scope of the patent it is an infringement.
8. In addition in order for copyright infringement to be established there must be a substantial reproduction of the work in the alleged infringement. However even clips or parts of an overall work may be regarded as works in their own right and if reproduced would constitute copyright infringement. So if we take the song "We're in the Money" from Gold-Diggers (1933) even though that is only a clip from a film it would still in my view attract copyright protection in its own right.
8. Copyright in a work is owned initially by the author (creator) of the work. However the author may if he so wishes license reproduction of the work to another party usually in return for a royalty payment on sales of the work and/or a lump sum. Alternatively he may sell or assign the copyright to the party on agreed terms but that assignment should ideally be in writing.
9. Where the author is an employee of a company say a TV or film company the employee may under the terms of his contract of employment have agreed that all copyright works he produces belong to the company.
10. Regarding the production of motion pictures the copyright position seems to me to be somewhat complicated. There may be several different authors involved. For instance, obviously if the film is based on a book or novel, the novelist will own the copyright in the novel. Then the screenwriter(s) will own the copyright in the screenplay. Possibly but this is a guess the director may own copyright in the film as he is the creative force behind it. Maybe even the actors/actresses own copyright in their performances. I am afraid this is an area where I have little or no knowledge. However I would assume that in the end the film studio or company will have negotiated contracts with all the artists involved to the effect that the studio or company owns the copyright in any material the artists create during their work in connection with the film. This is certainly what I would do if I were the boss of a film company.
11. On YouTube of which I am a regular and frequent user there are thousands of videos of all kinds which will be the subject of automatic copyright protection. Yet I have seen relatively few which have been removed because of "copyright violation". On the other hand I have only seen about 500 videos so even if I have only seen 10 videos removed that is quite a high percentage.
12. Why then aren't more videos removed on YouTube? I am afraid I don't know. I speculate that in many cases the video owner doesn't know the video has been posted. Maybe even if the video owner knows the video has been posted he doesn't care or he sees it as a sort of promotion for the product. Who knows.
13. It would appear that the worst that can happen to a user who posts an illegal video is that the video is removed. I have never heard of a user being sued for copyright infringement. Perhaps it would not be commercially worthwhile for the owner to sue the user. Users are not always told why their video has been removed. The video just suddenly disappears.
14. In the UK there are exemptions for copyright material which is being used for educational or research purposes. In addition time shifted recording of material on the radio and TV for personal use is exempt.
15. I understand that Google, the owners of YouTube, are negotiating with bodies representing copyright owners for a sort of blanket payment to these bodies for distribution to the copyright owners in return for a licence for users to post videos.
Well that's as much as I know so I hope you find it interesting and of some use. I cannot vouch for the accuracy of the material particularly in relation to the US.
Oh and one final point. This article is the subject of copyright protection lol.
David
Copyright
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jdb1
David, is that true - that in the UK a copyright begins to run only once the work is completed? I'm under the impression that here in the US a copyright runs from "the moment pen is put to paper." A small, but potentially signficant, difference. After all, as the creator, I can call that pencil squiggle complete, or I can work on it for another six months. Under US law, I'm protected, even if I work for another six years to perfect that squiggle. Who becomes the arbiter of "completion?"
(I don't mean to start a legal theory exchange here; just curious about UK law.)
(I don't mean to start a legal theory exchange here; just curious about UK law.)
Dear Brooklyn Girl
You raise a very interesting point and I have cheated and looked this matter up. It appears that in the US copyright subsists from the moment the work is "created". I take this to mean from the moment it is completed because until that time I would not have thought it was created.
I should have thought that a work was not in a state to be copied until it was complete because until then you don't really know what you've got to copy.
In order to establish copyright it is normal to date the work and possibly to sign it. So if you don't date and sign your initial squiggle you may not be able to prove your copyright. In the US but not in the UK and Europe it is possible to register your work at the US Copyright Office as proof of your ownership.
Regarding the point raised by our friend Ollie what usually happens is that the artists in order to get a recording contract or a book published or whatever assign their copyright away to the studio or publisher and far too cheaply normally. Then as in the case of Prince and George Michael after they have become successful they spend years fighting the record company for return of the rights. The answer is for artists to fight to retain copyright in all their works because only this will enable them to exercise full artistic freedom. Fortunately in the case of the record industry at least with the advent of the internet it is possible for artists to produce and market their material themselves while retaining full ownership of the copyright.
You raise a very interesting point and I have cheated and looked this matter up. It appears that in the US copyright subsists from the moment the work is "created". I take this to mean from the moment it is completed because until that time I would not have thought it was created.
I should have thought that a work was not in a state to be copied until it was complete because until then you don't really know what you've got to copy.
In order to establish copyright it is normal to date the work and possibly to sign it. So if you don't date and sign your initial squiggle you may not be able to prove your copyright. In the US but not in the UK and Europe it is possible to register your work at the US Copyright Office as proof of your ownership.
Regarding the point raised by our friend Ollie what usually happens is that the artists in order to get a recording contract or a book published or whatever assign their copyright away to the studio or publisher and far too cheaply normally. Then as in the case of Prince and George Michael after they have become successful they spend years fighting the record company for return of the rights. The answer is for artists to fight to retain copyright in all their works because only this will enable them to exercise full artistic freedom. Fortunately in the case of the record industry at least with the advent of the internet it is possible for artists to produce and market their material themselves while retaining full ownership of the copyright.
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jdb1
Well, David, I cheated a little, too. I'm not an attorney, but I am a legal assistant in a TM and copyright firm. What I hear the attorneys tell clients most often is that copyright runs from the "pen to paper" moment, and on that basis they are defended. You posting was most interesting.
Regards,
Judith
Regards,
Judith
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moira finnie
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FYI:
There have been cases here in the U.S. in which mutually beneficial copyright agreements have begun to be somewhat friendlier & looser (a lawyer friend calls these "extra-legal") relationships between those who provide platforms such as a message board, blog, etc. and those who post there. In some individual cases there have been written agreements to allow the author of a piece of writing, picture, etc. to use, publish & generate income from their creation as long as the original source of publication is acknowledged.
My question for David & Judith is this:
Having had several friends and family members living and working in Saudi Arabia, Asia & Africa, it's become clear that copyright laws outside of the "Western World" are ignored or unenforceable. As anyone who's walked down the streets of NYC, San Francisco or Boston knows, you can buy all kinds of bootleg music, dvds, and even our old friends, books that are produced in and for the areas mentioned above, but they have begun to inevitably seep back into the U.S. (I don't know if the U.K. has this occur).
Is international copyright law going to be enforced worldwide in the future? Doesn't the pervasiveness of the internet and the spread of information (and misinformation) make it even more unlikely to be practically applied in any way?
If it becomes largely meaningless, what happens to the creators? How do they support themselves?
Thanks for any knowledge and comments that you may wish to share.
There have been cases here in the U.S. in which mutually beneficial copyright agreements have begun to be somewhat friendlier & looser (a lawyer friend calls these "extra-legal") relationships between those who provide platforms such as a message board, blog, etc. and those who post there. In some individual cases there have been written agreements to allow the author of a piece of writing, picture, etc. to use, publish & generate income from their creation as long as the original source of publication is acknowledged.
My question for David & Judith is this:
Having had several friends and family members living and working in Saudi Arabia, Asia & Africa, it's become clear that copyright laws outside of the "Western World" are ignored or unenforceable. As anyone who's walked down the streets of NYC, San Francisco or Boston knows, you can buy all kinds of bootleg music, dvds, and even our old friends, books that are produced in and for the areas mentioned above, but they have begun to inevitably seep back into the U.S. (I don't know if the U.K. has this occur).
Is international copyright law going to be enforced worldwide in the future? Doesn't the pervasiveness of the internet and the spread of information (and misinformation) make it even more unlikely to be practically applied in any way?
If it becomes largely meaningless, what happens to the creators? How do they support themselves?
Thanks for any knowledge and comments that you may wish to share.
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jdb1
Moira, there are world bodies whose brief it is to police such things. However, it seems they don't yet have the necessary clout which would make them as effective as they should be. It's an evolving processs right now. Additionally, I hope David will forgive me for saying so, but the European/Asian way of doing things in this regard involves so much red tape and multiple copies of everything, that the turnaround time from the filing of a complaint to the issuance of a ruling and the taking of action can render the entire process prohibitively expensive, and sometimes virtually meaningless. But that is getting better.
In this country, certainly our clients are becoming quite proactive in defending their own intellectual property, forming various consortiums to work together to identify and stop bootleggers (with the assistance of their attorneys, of course, and various law enforcement agencies at the local and federal level, including US Customs). This aspect of IP protection is fast becoming an entity unto itself, and we have a few specialists in this firm who coordinate such activities for our clients.
However, IP protection is also an aspect of doing business that many smaller concerns, everywhere, just don't understand, and they don't see why they can't do whatever they want, no matter who created the property to begin with. These people will very likely be the first to yell "foul" when they perceive their own rights in a work to be threatened.
It's going to take time for everyone to understand the concept of intellectual property, but it will happen, I suspect as more and more people create their own properties and wish to protect them.
In this country, certainly our clients are becoming quite proactive in defending their own intellectual property, forming various consortiums to work together to identify and stop bootleggers (with the assistance of their attorneys, of course, and various law enforcement agencies at the local and federal level, including US Customs). This aspect of IP protection is fast becoming an entity unto itself, and we have a few specialists in this firm who coordinate such activities for our clients.
However, IP protection is also an aspect of doing business that many smaller concerns, everywhere, just don't understand, and they don't see why they can't do whatever they want, no matter who created the property to begin with. These people will very likely be the first to yell "foul" when they perceive their own rights in a work to be threatened.
It's going to take time for everyone to understand the concept of intellectual property, but it will happen, I suspect as more and more people create their own properties and wish to protect them.
I'm gratified at the debate I started here but I do feel more and more of an amateur. I think we will all have to beguided by Judith here in respect of US copyright law and the actions currently being taken to protect it.
Yes we do get loads of bootlegged material in the UK from the territories you mention and it is very difficult to stop it being imported and illegally sold.
I do concur most heartily with Judith when she says that small concerns and individuals regard intellectual property as immoral until their ip is purloined or infringed then it's a different story.
The fact is, if we look at patents for an example, it costs an arm and a leg to develop a product in terms of R & D, production, marketing, sales and advertising. A patent gives you an opportunity to derive some sort of return on this investment. In order to secure a patent you must let details of it be published so that others can improve it and the technology progress. If any tom dick and harry can use this technology for free then eventually all innovation would stop or be kept secret which would prohibit further innovation.
The major problem is to my mind not that intellectual property is wrong in concept but that the rights are so expensive and time consuming to enforce and thus this puts the small entity or individual at a considerable disadvantage against the big boys. This is the area where reform is necessary not ending the ip system and allowing a free for all except where that is sensible such as on the internet.
David
Yes we do get loads of bootlegged material in the UK from the territories you mention and it is very difficult to stop it being imported and illegally sold.
I do concur most heartily with Judith when she says that small concerns and individuals regard intellectual property as immoral until their ip is purloined or infringed then it's a different story.
The fact is, if we look at patents for an example, it costs an arm and a leg to develop a product in terms of R & D, production, marketing, sales and advertising. A patent gives you an opportunity to derive some sort of return on this investment. In order to secure a patent you must let details of it be published so that others can improve it and the technology progress. If any tom dick and harry can use this technology for free then eventually all innovation would stop or be kept secret which would prohibit further innovation.
The major problem is to my mind not that intellectual property is wrong in concept but that the rights are so expensive and time consuming to enforce and thus this puts the small entity or individual at a considerable disadvantage against the big boys. This is the area where reform is necessary not ending the ip system and allowing a free for all except where that is sensible such as on the internet.
David
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moira finnie
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Thanks to Judith & David for their input. I was aware of Interpol's role as a primary enforcer of intellectual property laws on an international scale, but don't believe that their efforts can necessarily safeguard without real international consensus, which I don't see happening soon.
Judith,
I wish that you'd write more about your legal background on occasion. I know that you're going to say that you're just a spear-carrier in the world of torts, transcripts and transgressions, but it is fascinating to see you occasionally unfold the remarkable amount of knowledge about several areas as you have here. You make me think.
That's a good thing. (I think
)
David,
If I haven't gotten around to saying it yet, Welcome! Your posts seem to be both thoughtful, lively and informative. I hope that you'll continue to add your comments as the spirit moves you. I appreciate your presence, as I do all the members--especially since we seem to have such a variety of backgrounds, interests and ways of expressing ourselves.
Judith,
I wish that you'd write more about your legal background on occasion. I know that you're going to say that you're just a spear-carrier in the world of torts, transcripts and transgressions, but it is fascinating to see you occasionally unfold the remarkable amount of knowledge about several areas as you have here. You make me think.
That's a good thing. (I think
)David,
If I haven't gotten around to saying it yet, Welcome! Your posts seem to be both thoughtful, lively and informative. I hope that you'll continue to add your comments as the spirit moves you. I appreciate your presence, as I do all the members--especially since we seem to have such a variety of backgrounds, interests and ways of expressing ourselves.
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jdb1
Thank you, Moira, but the fact that I am not attorney constrains me from expounding too fully in any legal area, not that I'm an expert on anything ---- something I say may be construed as legal advice, and that's not allowed. [DISCLAIMER: Please be advised that anything I say in that regard is personal opinion, and for purposes of parody only. Any resemblance to coherent thought, living or dead, is strictly coincidental. ]
Anyway, I've always been more interested in the theory, than the practice, of Law.
]Anyway, I've always been more interested in the theory, than the practice, of Law.
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moira finnie
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Hi Judith,
I'm in the same boat when people ask me about investing. Mum's the word, for legal reasons or the NASD (who should have enough on their plate already these days) could come knocking on my door.
It's not just law, though Jdb1. You sometimes insert a bit of esoteric knowledge about something totally unexpected in alot of your posts. The arts, books, NYC, pets, opera, all kinds of things. That's really what I meant to say in my garbled fashion.
I'm in the same boat when people ask me about investing. Mum's the word, for legal reasons or the NASD (who should have enough on their plate already these days) could come knocking on my door.
It's not just law, though Jdb1. You sometimes insert a bit of esoteric knowledge about something totally unexpected in alot of your posts. The arts, books, NYC, pets, opera, all kinds of things. That's really what I meant to say in my garbled fashion.
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jdb1
Thanks, Moira, but it's a mixed blessing: nobody I know will play Trivial Pursuit with me. It's not my fault I have a head for trivia - I was born that way! 
Some people collect stamps --- I collect facts. I can see myself decades down the road, an old, confused woman scribbling away at her magnum opus, De Nihilo Nihil, desperately trying to get it all down on paper (or whatever medium is in use at that time) . . . . .
Some people collect stamps --- I collect facts. I can see myself decades down the road, an old, confused woman scribbling away at her magnum opus, De Nihilo Nihil, desperately trying to get it all down on paper (or whatever medium is in use at that time) . . . . .
I must say I am impressed with the comments on this site and the expertise and knowledge of the people involved. I feel somewhat humble and inadequate.
I know very little about films to be quite honest and I suppose I can take them or leave them. I certainly have no expertise in any film genre or type. So I suppose I'm something of a fraud. I know far more about music.
I am a qualified British and European patent and trade mark attorney. I have filed and processed British originating patent and trade mark applications in the US for over 30 years but apart from providing the US attorneys with information I leave the prosecution up to the US attorneys. Of course with the passage of time one picks up details of the US systems and one can predict with some accuracy what is likely to happen. In general I would say that as with other areas I know far more about US ip systems than my American counterparts know about European ip systems.
Americans are going to have to change and become less insular, look outward and learn about other countries, systems and cultures. The US is probably no longer the world's main economic driver just as the UK lost this position after the first world war. Owing to the collapse of the dollar for the first time since 1850 the average British worker earns more than his American counterpart. The German economy is far stronger than the British economy mainly but not merely in my view because the UK has adopted US borrowing and wheeler dealing trading practices whereas the Germans have pursued patient long term investment practices and concentrated on making and selling world class products
I might be able to give you a run for your money Judith on Trivial Pursuit it would all depend on what the category was.
Sorry about this diatribe, economics is something about which I do have some expertise.
David
I know very little about films to be quite honest and I suppose I can take them or leave them. I certainly have no expertise in any film genre or type. So I suppose I'm something of a fraud. I know far more about music.
I am a qualified British and European patent and trade mark attorney. I have filed and processed British originating patent and trade mark applications in the US for over 30 years but apart from providing the US attorneys with information I leave the prosecution up to the US attorneys. Of course with the passage of time one picks up details of the US systems and one can predict with some accuracy what is likely to happen. In general I would say that as with other areas I know far more about US ip systems than my American counterparts know about European ip systems.
Americans are going to have to change and become less insular, look outward and learn about other countries, systems and cultures. The US is probably no longer the world's main economic driver just as the UK lost this position after the first world war. Owing to the collapse of the dollar for the first time since 1850 the average British worker earns more than his American counterpart. The German economy is far stronger than the British economy mainly but not merely in my view because the UK has adopted US borrowing and wheeler dealing trading practices whereas the Germans have pursued patient long term investment practices and concentrated on making and selling world class products
I might be able to give you a run for your money Judith on Trivial Pursuit it would all depend on what the category was.
Sorry about this diatribe, economics is something about which I do have some expertise.
David
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jdb1
David, as do most of our members, you probably know much more about film than you realize, and surely you have likes and dislikes. We would be very interested to hear about them. That's what SSO is all about.
By the way, I have to agree with you about the insularity of us Yanks. That attitude has gotten a lot worse over the last 20 years or so (thank you, Ronald Reagan). You would be appalled to watch American news programs, especially the local ones. One might think there was no other country on Planet Earth besides our own (and many do think just that). Luckily, in NYC we are able to access a great many foreign news broadcasts on our cable stations, including BBCWorld, RAI, Canal 4, EuroNews and Deutsche Welle (and many others, which unforunately for me don't broadcast in English or use subtitles), which I count on to tell me what's really going on out there.
By the way, I have to agree with you about the insularity of us Yanks. That attitude has gotten a lot worse over the last 20 years or so (thank you, Ronald Reagan). You would be appalled to watch American news programs, especially the local ones. One might think there was no other country on Planet Earth besides our own (and many do think just that). Luckily, in NYC we are able to access a great many foreign news broadcasts on our cable stations, including BBCWorld, RAI, Canal 4, EuroNews and Deutsche Welle (and many others, which unforunately for me don't broadcast in English or use subtitles), which I count on to tell me what's really going on out there.
Many thanks Judith for your warm reply.
Of course I do have favourite films and in the course of time these will emerge I hope in the appropriate context.
I am afraid I tend to spend more time on the computer these days messaging my world wide YouTube friends than I do watching films. I get tremendous satisfaction out of messaging people because I like writing, I'm quite good at it and you can learn about other cultures. This of course is almost a totally new and welcome phenomenon thanks to the internet and the derivatives therefrom YouTube, MySpace and the like.
Doesn't CNN carry international news?
I suppose we've always been internationalist in this country but surprisingly enough we pay far more attention to what goes on in the US than we do to what goes on in Europe even though we are notionally at least in the EU (but not in the Euro) but I assume that's a language thing. It is just as well we're not in the Euro at present because the Euro is appreciating rapidly against the pound as it is against the dollar and this is significantly improving our dreadfully weak trading position. Actually I think Australia's more popular here than Europe.
I was in Washington DC in 1985 for a week to interview an examiner at the Patent Office (not with any great success). I was struck with the parochialism of US TV of course. I was also struck with the sheer volume and extent of advertisements which totally ruined programmes for me. For instance "Happy Days" which was current then and which I quite like is a half hour progamme but lasted an hour with I think six advert breaks. In this country the commercial stations are bad enough but there is only one three minute advert break halfway through. In the end I switched to Public Service Broadcasting the output of which is 70% British but I would like to have seen more indigenous US output.
David
Of course I do have favourite films and in the course of time these will emerge I hope in the appropriate context.
I am afraid I tend to spend more time on the computer these days messaging my world wide YouTube friends than I do watching films. I get tremendous satisfaction out of messaging people because I like writing, I'm quite good at it and you can learn about other cultures. This of course is almost a totally new and welcome phenomenon thanks to the internet and the derivatives therefrom YouTube, MySpace and the like.
Doesn't CNN carry international news?
I suppose we've always been internationalist in this country but surprisingly enough we pay far more attention to what goes on in the US than we do to what goes on in Europe even though we are notionally at least in the EU (but not in the Euro) but I assume that's a language thing. It is just as well we're not in the Euro at present because the Euro is appreciating rapidly against the pound as it is against the dollar and this is significantly improving our dreadfully weak trading position. Actually I think Australia's more popular here than Europe.
I was in Washington DC in 1985 for a week to interview an examiner at the Patent Office (not with any great success). I was struck with the parochialism of US TV of course. I was also struck with the sheer volume and extent of advertisements which totally ruined programmes for me. For instance "Happy Days" which was current then and which I quite like is a half hour progamme but lasted an hour with I think six advert breaks. In this country the commercial stations are bad enough but there is only one three minute advert break halfway through. In the end I switched to Public Service Broadcasting the output of which is 70% British but I would like to have seen more indigenous US output.
David