Nell - Eleanor Doheny....

[knitwit45]

hey,Larry, it's been a while since we had a good Nell story...

How about Nell and the Cadillac Mafia? (I think that's what you called the ladies that all attended the same church). Or some stories from her days in Imperial Russia? Or some of her adventures in Hollywood?

Thanks!
Nancy

[moira finnie]

Testing...testing...testing

[Vecchiolarry]

Hi Everyone,

My recent trip to Los Angeles:

I was scheduled to go from May 30th to June 2nd for Elaine Stewart's birthday party on the 31st; but my mother died on May 22nd and I thought it wouldn't look de rigeur socially if I was flying off to LA while she was being buried.
So, I postponed everything till June 17th...

June 17th:
Had dinner with Lynn at "Musso & Franks" in Hollywood. The place hasn't changed at all since it was first opened in 1919. We had a booth, so everything was quite comfortable.
We discussed lots of things but mostly movie stars - Roz & Loretta & Irene Dunne, etc. We had a nice, relaxing & delightful dinner.
She kindly drove me back to the Beverly Hills Hotel.
We were sorry Kyle couldn't join us but he had to work....

June 18th:
Had my driver take me to Hollywood Boulevard and walked half way up and down it. Some of the stars are kept pretty clean but most are in a dirty and damaged state, specially toward Vine Street. Didn't walk on Vine Street as it was too hot and I'm now too old for maraton walking bouts. Saw Mae Murray's star and blew her a kiss (loved her!)...
Went back to the Chinese Theater and saw all the cement prints again. Happily they have not pulled up all the old stars for new replacements - Clark and Cary and Gary and John Wayne are all still there, as are Pola and even Constance Talmadge. But there are now a lot of the current crop and some i wonder "why??" ---- Ali MacGraw? Cameron Diaz??
Had dinner at the Hollywood Roosevelt, which was quite good.

June 19th:
Next day I had my driver take me 'back home' to Roxbury Drive - the street is now changed and most homes there are now huge and take up 2 to 3 lots.
Lucille Ball's house, James Stewart's house, Jack Benny's house and Agnes Moorehead's house are all gone and "something else" is in their place(s)...
Nell's house is now gone and there is a nondescript beige block house there with a big old rusting gate there. And the house now faces west instead of north - I was quite sad to see her beautiful Greek temple house gone; but I think her east & west porticos are now attached to a monstrosity being built on Sunset Blvd. At least it looked like them when I walked by there....
Drove down to Figueroa & West Adams Blvd. to St. Vincent de Paul Cathedral, which was built by my great grandfather. Went inside and it is still a spectacular sight. Very Mexican & Spanish and many side altars, all carved with intricate work.
Then drove over to Chester Place, my great grandparents home. It's now a gated community and Marymount University now owns all the area.
Couldn't get into the house but didn't expect to anyway. But was surprised later that night when I watched "Catch Me If You Can" and saw the reception room at Chester Place used as a dining room with Leonard de Caprio & Christopher Walden!!! All those Sienna marble columns and Tiffany glass dome - all a little overly ostentatious but it brought back memories of my darling Estelle (my step-great grandmother)......
Then, drove over to Greystone Manor (my Aunt Lucy's home) and walked around the gardens. It was a beautiful day, so spent time viewing the fountains, swimming pool and various terraces. The place now belongs to the City of Beverly Hills and the house can be viewed by invitation only now.

June 20th:
Spent most of the day at the hotel pool but didn't go in.
Had a dinner for friends in the Polo Lounge - a round table for 8, including Lynn and her husband.
We all discussed royalty and the movies and I think everyone had a good time. The food was good, I had lamb chops; and we shared desserts, I had creme brule.....

June 21st:
Nice breakfast at the Fountain Court in the hotel and then got ready to go to the opera.
I took friends to see their first opera, "La Traviata" at the Dorothy Chandler Pavilion. I had never been to the Pavilion, as it was built after I left LA.
The opera was first rate and quite superb. The sets and costumes were first rate and the singing excellent, especially the baritone, who hit & held a difficult note after a rather long aria. Kudos to him!!
We went to the Founders Lounge and had champagne, courtesy of an LA friend I know through musical circles.
Then, we all went to a big barbeque at a friends home in Brentwood. So much food and more champagne.

June 22nd:
To LAX and home. Found the airport quite easy to maneouver through and was surprised security was quick and efficient (usually not the case). Ate lunch at "Spagos" - not the greatest - sometimes Wolfgang Puck is quite overrated...

I was very happy to meet Lynn and Jon.
I never did see or hear from Elaine Stewart, although she knew I was coming. She was invited to my dinner on the 20th but had other commitments.
I did hear that if I'd made her birthday party on May 31st, I would have met Rhonda Fleming and Ruta Lee. Gene Barry was there too and I had known him in the early 50's also.

My next trip:
River cruise up the Rhine and down the Danube from Amsterdam to Bucharest - 28 days in September.
Then 4 days in Istanbul,
and then, meeting up with my seniors group in Cairo in October to sail up and then down the Nile for 12 days....
I should be water logged by November!!!

Larry

[mongoII]

Hi Larry,

It's nice to see you on the boards again. I'm sorry to hear the news of your mother. May she rest in peace.

Sounds like that you had a good time in Hollywood (lucky dog). It's nice to know that you hooked up with my friends Lynn and Jon (nice folks). If I ate at Musso & Franks I would have ordered a nice big corned beef sandwich on rye, with a pickle and cole slaw of course.
Interesting also was your visit to the Hollywood Walk of Fame and Grauman's (Manns). Glad to hear that they still have slabs of cement with the vintage movie stars.
Glad you had a good time and made the best of it. Did you ever get to London?

Joe

[Vecchiolarry]

Hi Joe,

Yes, I did go to London in April and had a marvellous time. have many good friends in London and in Sussex & Kent, so was quite busy.
Took 'the tube' everywhere and people were very helpful to a stupid tourist. I have a Canada maple leaf lapel pin, so everyone was very kind....

I did find myself missing Moira Lister, who was a great buddy to me in the past; but she had actually moved back to South Africa anyway before she died last year...

Larry

[Lzcutter]

Larry,

So glad that you were able to post here again! Hallelujah!

Just so everyone knows, meeting Larry is one of the best things you can do. He is a walking encyclopedia of film stuff and can tell you who lived where and other great delightful stories. But, ya'll knew that. But it is even better to hear the stories in person!!!!

Both Mr Cutter and I are extremely happy that we had the opportunity to finally meet up with him!

[jdb1]

Thank you so much for the rundown, Larry. I am so sorry to hear about your mother, but I trust she had a very long, and very eventful life.

It must have been quite a bittersweet and emotional experience to pass by all your old haunts. The tearing down of fine old building and replacing them with crass ostentation isn't peculiar to LA; it's happening here in New York as well. I thought we had gotten over that "Old is Bad, New is Good" school of archtectural thought 20 years ago. I hope there is enough left for you to re-visit again and again. Tell me: did many of these places seem smaller to you than you remembered? Often the case when you go back after many years.

Here's a thought: find a good photographer, and put together a book about the glory days of Los Angeles. Your insights would be far better than those of some contract author who has no personal history with the place.

Looking forward to hearing more.

[Vecchiolarry]

Hi Judith,

Yes, I must say that Chester Place seemed smaller than when I was a kid there; but Greystone manor is still huge (it always was a monstrosity!).... But the grounds are magnificent and open to the public...

Larry

[Vecchiolarry]

Hi,

Am transfering some of Nell's concerns from the Jesse Royce Landis thread to here:

At a formal dinner party, usually one would have hors d'ourves and a highball or a wine for about a half hour and then progress into dinner, escorting either whom the hostess paired you with or just pick your own lady if the hostess hasn't specified.
Usually there is a place card present but not always.
The person seated at the host's and hostess' right is the guest(s) of honour and sometimes the is a seating plan in order of precedence. But, not today really as everybody is deemed as "equal"

Travelling with Nell could get "touchy" as she was like to banish people from her table if she was slighted. Such happened to poor Dolores Gray onboard the Queen Mary in 1947, when Dolores unwittingly oneupped Nell in the number of steamer trunks each brought onboard.
Stupid really - Nell detested her evermore but I remained a good friend to Dolores - and that was a bit of a sticky wicket.....

Larry

[Vecchiolarry]

Hi,

Nancy:
Nell was never at the Court of the Tsar, but in the Dowager Empress' Household; there is a difference.... I know it all sounds so glittering and glamourous, but the Tsar's court was pretty glum and non-existant as they hardly entertained or appeared in public.
They lived outside St. Petersburg and seldom went to the city.

The Dowager Empress lived in the Anichkov Palace on the Fontanka Canal, right in the middle of town and she did entertain.
She is known to have had "the best table in Europe" and very wonderful dances. Nell was Chatelaine of the Household, meaning chief lady-in-waiting (but in public) and did not accompany her for private visits to relatives. So, she never really saw Nicholas and Alexandra - only twice, I think....

The day Nell died, she was going to Mae Murray's funeral. She came downstairs and as she approached her butler at the front door, she dropped dead at his feet. Poor Herbert!!
Herbert died on April 30th - 47 years and 1 month to the day Nell died. He was 98...

Larry

[Vecchiolarry]

Hi,

Nell was 10 in 1900, when the Dowager Empress and her sister, Queen Alexandra, encountered her at the Paris Exhibition.... They were exhibiting some of their belongings and were checking reaction of the public, I think....
Both were taken with Nell's admiration of all the beautiful things they owned and in due time Nell and her sister, Carrie, were enrolled in the Smolney Institute in Russia.
She only became Chatelaine because she married the Chevalier of the Household, Prince Cantacuzene....
After the Russian Orthodox Church annulled her marriage, she moved to Paris in April 1914.
In June 1914, WWI started and the Prince was murdered by the Bolsheviks.
The Dowager Empress escaped to the Crimea and onto a British warship.

Larry

[Vecchiolarry]

Hi Wendy,

Prince Cantacuzene was indeed a horseman. His position would have been equal to the British monarchy's Master of the Horse in The Queen Mother's court.

The Cantacuzene's originally came for Byzantium and a couple of them were Emperors there. Not always the safest position in that corrupt empire.
After 1453, when Constantinople fell to the Ottoman Turks, the Cantacuzenes hightailed it out of there and went to Rome before settling in Rumania - there are still Cantacuzenes there today. The Cantacuzene Palace in Bucharest is a sight to behold - very ornate, mosaic and paraquet floors, both gold and painted ceilings and with several classical & baroque & roccoco rooms...
I'm sure they must have stripped the Constantinople treasury before they left.

A minor branch of them left and fought for & supported Peter the Great in Russia; and so were ennobled to Prince. But, in the Russian societal strata, I don't think they were as high up as many other Russian noble families....
They were simply loyal to the monarch but not too prominent really.

However, this did not prevent Nell from catawalling the title "Princess" once she returned to the USA.
I asked her once why some people still called her Princess Eleanor; and she said matter of factly that when she came back to NYC in 1936, the newspapers wrote that Princess Eleanor Romanov had returned and "I simply didn't correct them!!"... And, she never did....

Larry

[mongoII]

Larry, most fascinating indeed.

[knitwit45]

Hi Larry.
I've gone back and re-read this entire thread, what a life she lived! I would love to have seen her and you and all the entourage boarding trains and steamships....
Did she think air travel was too crass? too dangerous? too speedy? I would love to sail to Europe, it just seems like such a civilized, elegant way to travel (P.O.S.H)

thanks for reviving this thread, and hope to read more!

[Lzcutter]

Greystone Manor in Beverly Hills:




Larry, I thought it might be good to have a visual to go with your great thread!